PDA

View Full Version : Colt 1911 in .455 Webley Auto



Jibz
13-11-2018, 09:35 PM
Yes, thatís correct; itís not a Typo. The title does say Colt 1911 in .455 Webley Auto.

So here is how the story begins. Around 2 weeks back I was enjoying Kahwa at a friendís shop when a guy entered and produced a 1911 from under his clothes. Generally it would seem like a matter of concern if an unknown person enters a shop and draws a handgun from under his clothes BUT we were not worried because the shop was a gun store. So as it happens, he was looking to find a buyer for it. My friend didnít show any interest in it however, I wanted to see what it was. The markings said Colt 1911 blah blah blah and on the right hand side of the slide, it read ďCOLT AUTOMATIC CALIBRE 45$Ē. Yes, the last digit after 5 looked as if it has been messed around with.

After getting due permission from the guy, I disassembled the handgun. Unlike its outer condition, the insides were in excellent state. The barrel grooves had worn out a little bit but still they were there. The guy joined us for a cup of Kahwa and there it was; we reached a deal and the old shabby Colt found a new owner.

Brought it back home and disassembled it once again. Now all this time, I was absolutely clueless to the historic background of the handgun which I had acquired. So there I was, trying to insert a .45 ACP round in the chamber and getting frustrated and surprised that the darn round was rattling inside the chamber big time. I placed the same round in my US&S 1911 barrelís chamber and it seated snugly. Fortunately, instead of panicking (which I normally do), I Googled the markings of the handgun and Voila, it was a totally different beast altogether. One such link which gave a pretty good idea of what this 1911 was, http://www.icollector.com/Early-WWI-Colt-Commercial-Government-Model-Pistol_i11003911

A much heightened level of reverence embedded in my heart for this handgun, which was no ordinary 1911 but an extraordinary piece from history. It turned out that it was a Colt 1911 Chambered in .455 Webley Auto. The Wikipedia had the following to say about it. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.455_Webley)

ďThe Webley & Scott pistol was sold to the Royal Flying Corps and Royal Navy during World War I. There were also some Colt M1911 pistols chambered in .455 Auto purchased by the Royal Navy. Although not a standard sidearm or a standard service cartridge, a few Colt M1911 "British Service Models" chambered in .455 Auto were sold commercially to British Navy and Army officers through outfitters. The service ammunition came packed in 7-round boxes stamped "Not For Revolvers" to prevent confusion.Ē

Now coming to the grips; they were transparent and awful looking and that was because someone had drilled small decorative holes in the insides of the grips to make them aesthetically acceptable and instead ruined them in the process. When I shared the pics of the grips with a friend, his keen observation immediately identified them as the 1911 Sweetheart Grips. https://www.thevintagenews.com/2016/09/02/sweetheart-grips-wwii-soldiers-known-take-precious-family-photos-put-clear-grips-pistols-2-2/. So what I had was a historic 1911 with grips which in our woods are rare as a Henís Teeth.

Here are some pics of how it looked when I got it.
https://images2.imgbox.com/4b/a0/lBBYipTt_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/lBBYipTt)


https://images2.imgbox.com/8c/e0/xW5zaMTT_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/xW5zaMTT)

https://images2.imgbox.com/a8/4d/GWTzX4dr_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/GWTzX4dr)

https://images2.imgbox.com/b6/f3/HRv2Dkxq_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/HRv2Dkxq)

https://images2.imgbox.com/5a/95/8YUo178f_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/8YUo178f)


https://imgbox.com/lBBYipTthttps://imgbox.com/lBBYipTtAnd hence I had another restoration project at hand. Details in next posts. InshAllah
Stay Tuned.

Jibz
13-11-2018, 09:36 PM
The next step in line was to get it complete disassembled. In my excitement, spent almost 3 hours on it, inspecting each and every part, visualizing how it would look when I am done with it. As I mentioned earlier, the internals were in pretty good condition as there was no metal wear anywhere.

https://images2.imgbox.com/b8/f2/8pM1tDiD_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/8pM1tDiD)

https://images2.imgbox.com/c9/be/q6xsIkLC_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/q6xsIkLC)

https://images2.imgbox.com/58/11/T9ng9sYq_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/T9ng9sYq)


By the way here is how the Sweetheart Grips from WW1 looked like.

https://images2.imgbox.com/96/46/YRx0XlGu_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/YRx0XlGu)



For the restoration, all parts were first Sand Blasted. Here is how they turned out.

https://images2.imgbox.com/97/df/JK3jaUq3_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/JK3jaUq3)


The checkering on the Mag Release, Slide Release and safety lever were in immaculate condition. Before the sandblast, I was thinking that these parts may require re-checkering; I was glad that they didn't.

https://images2.imgbox.com/33/0e/FnAbQpTq_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/FnAbQpTq)

https://images2.imgbox.com/7f/4f/9KEAKz2X_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/9KEAKz2X)


https://images2.imgbox.com/74/2b/UIejJWHg_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/UIejJWHg)



The markings on the frame were also clearly visible after the sandblasting

The Inspectors Marking "y" on the trigger guard
https://images2.imgbox.com/73/70/KrvJN6VF_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/KrvJN6VF)


Marking of a "CROWN and letter V under it". This marking is right under the Safety Lever on the frame.
https://images2.imgbox.com/20/70/WvOBs5og_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/WvOBs5og)

https://images2.imgbox.com/eb/ee/tKYOtoTD_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/tKYOtoTD)

Few more Inspector Marks.
https://images2.imgbox.com/13/13/EmPFqt2s_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/EmPFqt2s)

Rest of the details in next post. Stay Tuned.

Jibz
13-11-2018, 09:37 PM
I wanted few of its parts to be shiny and bling bling. The Magazine, Grip Safety Lever, Trigger, Round Follower and the Main Spring Housing were treated with a wire buff first and then with a cloth buff. The result was as following however the pictured parts were later blued.

https://images2.imgbox.com/df/36/T3G253Np_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/T3G253Np)

https://images2.imgbox.com/b1/75/4kgcyq4q_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/4kgcyq4q)

https://images2.imgbox.com/a1/27/fHaucodX_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/fHaucodX)

https://images2.imgbox.com/8a/76/yJMyvxv8_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/yJMyvxv8)


I wanted to surface grind the slide to give it an even finish but the problem was that the machine wheel had a little play in it and that almost cost me the whole project. Anyways, the alternative was adopted to file it manually with a 400 grit cloth backed abrasive/sand paper. The result was something like this.

https://images2.imgbox.com/df/f6/tX5DaACK_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/tX5DaACK)

https://images2.imgbox.com/0b/cb/TiePcx1h_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/TiePcx1h)

https://images2.imgbox.com/e9/16/WM552Dve_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/WM552Dve)

https://images2.imgbox.com/6a/f7/TiyAwVmw_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/TiyAwVmw)

After using 400 grit sandpaper, it took another 2 hours to make the surface perfectly even by using 800 grit paper; trust me it requires a lot of elbow grease.

All the small parts, including the slide and the frame were blued. The following is the pic when I was getting ready to assemble all the parts.

https://images2.imgbox.com/2e/78/bbu0WSn1_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/bbu0WSn1)

And the final assembled pics with my photography skills are in the next post. Stay Tuned.

Jibz
13-11-2018, 09:37 PM
So after spending almost more than 20 man-hours on it, the old and shabby Colt had a new life to begin with. As I didnt have any other grips readily available, I had to install the grips from my US&S 1911A1 to give it a somewhat period correct look.

Now before you all start asking THE question, "I suspended the handgun in the air with a thread and then erased the thread in the pics with Picasa". There you have it; now the pictures of the finished product.

https://images2.imgbox.com/b7/e4/yJrLfFUb_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/yJrLfFUb)

https://images2.imgbox.com/cb/42/EuROUGlQ_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/EuROUGlQ)

https://images2.imgbox.com/57/80/gs3XwUN5_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/gs3XwUN5)

https://images2.imgbox.com/c2/34/TBl48wXo_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/TBl48wXo)

https://images2.imgbox.com/69/72/35eeM8dn_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/35eeM8dn)

https://images2.imgbox.com/7f/10/RRz2uLYa_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/RRz2uLYa)

https://images2.imgbox.com/cb/37/JPnX1mwO_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/JPnX1mwO)

https://images2.imgbox.com/40/a9/p2FXjC9j_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/p2FXjC9j)


https://images2.imgbox.com/02/a4/s6RcfoQ2_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/s6RcfoQ2)

https://images2.imgbox.com/42/cd/SLfEX0jE_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/SLfEX0jE)

https://images2.imgbox.com/ba/2e/CIa9QSlb_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/CIa9QSlb)

https://images2.imgbox.com/ac/cd/0sr3FLMW_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/0sr3FLMW)

Kamranwali
13-11-2018, 09:43 PM
Salaam All,
Jibz bhai..... WOW :D

Awsome find.......and I can only imagine what the reserved posts are for..... :D
Awaiting transformation pics.... :D

Many many congratulations for getting a very very rare gun. May it serve you well.

Regards.

AK47
14-11-2018, 12:08 AM
Why don't such "meteors" land in my lap? Lol!

At times I wonder whether it is luck tracing you, or you tracing the luck! In either case, wow!

Looking forward to the reserved posts!

mohsin.mashhadi
14-11-2018, 07:42 AM
Assalam o alaikum. Uffff...ma sha Allah...jibz lala...Lucky shd be ur alias��...ma sha Allah...a beauty indeed

Jibz
14-11-2018, 09:52 AM
Salaam All,
Jibz bhai..... WOW :D
Awsome find.......and I can only imagine what the reserved posts are for..... :D
Awaiting transformation pics.... :D
Many many congratulations for getting a very very rare gun. May it serve you well.
Regards.
Cheers Roor. I updated the thread with all the details.


Why don't such "meteors" land in my lap? Lol!
At times I wonder whether it is luck tracing you, or you tracing the luck! In either case, wow!
Looking forward to the reserved posts!
hahaha Sir, I believe that Luck Tracing Me is a better explanation for what falls in my lap each time. Many thanks sir.


Assalam o alaikum. Uffff...ma sha Allah...jibz lala...Lucky shd be ur alias😄...ma sha Allah...a beauty indeed
Manana Roor. Stay blessed.

Enigmatic Desires
14-11-2018, 10:09 AM
I am absolutely speechless.. Some of the the world's first airmen went to war with these More then a hundred years ago.. Wow.. just just Wow.. I can imagine a Sopwith Camel pilot taking potshots at a Gotha Bomber with this. (and perhaps, he probably did too)

FA226
14-11-2018, 10:51 AM
MashaAllah,beautiful.
restoration job done nicely as usual.

fezan
14-11-2018, 11:19 AM
What a find, restoration and equally well-written blog. Jibz you keep the thrill alive here. Stay blessed. Indeed it is a pride worth acquisition in your collection

Jibz
14-11-2018, 11:39 AM
I am absolutely speechless.. Some of the the world's first airmen went to war with these More then a hundred years ago.. Wow.. just just Wow.. I can imagine a Sopwith Camel pilot taking potshots at a Gotha Bomber with this. (and perhaps, he probably did too)
Thats correct ED, one's imagination does wander off to the skies thinking that YES may be a pilot in a Sopwith or Bristol may have shot with it at his enemy in a Fokker. What a scene that must have been!!!.


MashaAllah,beautiful.
restoration job done nicely as usual.
Cheers roor. Manana


What a find, restoration and equally well-written blog. Jibz you keep the thrill alive here. Stay blessed. Indeed it is a pride worth acquisition in your collection
Thanks Roor. It has landed with my father now as he had always wanted a 1911. The Girsan MC1911 which I got him was NOT actually what he had expected so this definitely would do. Anything for my father. :smile:

For the information of all, here is how a .455 Auto looks in comparison to a 45 ACP.

https://images2.imgbox.com/33/39/CPQVC1et_o.jpeg (http://imgbox.com/CPQVC1et)


The ammo is almost non existent so the way out is to Change the barrel to 45 ACP. That way it would be dual caliber compatible.

AK47
14-11-2018, 11:54 AM
Salams..

You certainly shouldn't have alerted me for a re-visit here! Lol!

Now this indeed is a masterpiece of dedicated works!

Loved it! It is such projects which give meaning to a gunner's life-long enthusiastic span of collection !

I don't wanna say more here, as words are inadequate.. Will personally check it out during my coming winter visits...

I'd however suggest for viewer information, you highlight Webley. 455 ballistic qualities viz a viz. 45 Colt!

Best luck with this priceless beauty and invaluable piece of collection...

Regards..

shahroze
14-11-2018, 11:11 PM
Wow such dedication and detail is only expected from you.
Mesmerized by the quality of photos and the lucky beast you got Sire.
Congratulations.

MIRZA1988
15-11-2018, 07:02 AM
I have webely Pistol in same Cal.
It was actually my grand father pistol .
cal is 455 webely .
I have about 500 old rounds .
They are packed in soft metal foil box .

Dr Zakir
17-11-2018, 01:57 PM
Well done. A marvellous job .

Jibz
21-11-2018, 10:59 AM
Salams..
,,,,,,
Now this indeed is a masterpiece of dedicated works!
............
I'd however suggest for viewer information, you highlight Webley. 455 ballistic qualities viz a viz. 45 Colt!
..........
Regards..
Many Thanks Sir
If I understand you correctly, with comparison between the two you meant that the ballistics of .455 Webley Auto and .45 ACP should be stated, Right? Because .45 Colt is altogether a different cartridge.
According to Wikipedia, .455 Webley Auto Mk 1 service round from 1913 was loaded with a 224 grain cupro-nickel-jacketed bullet with a muzzle velocity of 700 feet per second. On the other hand a 230 grain Winchester .45 ACP has a velocity of 835 FPS. Now if we also take in to comparison a .45 Colt, its velocities range at around 900 FPS. I hope this information helps somewhat.


Wow such dedication and detail is only expected from you.
Mesmerized by the quality of photos and the lucky beast you got Sire.
Congratulations.
JazakAllah Khair Roor. Cheers


I have webely Pistol in same Cal.
It was actually my grand father pistol .
cal is 455 webely .
I have about 500 old rounds .
They are packed in soft metal foil box .
Now this is very interesting. I plan to change the barrel of this M1911 to .45 ACP, however I have no intention to part with the original barrel. Thus it would be great if I could get my hands on its original ammo of .455 Auto. I would highly appreciate if you would help a fellow gunner find the ammo OR may be willing to sell some from your stock.
My email is in my profile. Looking forward to hearing from you. Regards


Well done. A marvellous job .
Many Thanks Sir. Regards and Salams

Jibz
21-11-2018, 11:03 AM
Here are some more pics.

https://images2.imgbox.com/c5/73/p5uk0KVl_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/p5uk0KVl)

https://images2.imgbox.com/71/45/Mhe03FGn_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/Mhe03FGn)

https://images2.imgbox.com/15/47/8Bxsnsst_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/8Bxsnsst)

https://images2.imgbox.com/aa/f3/0oH1cdhK_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/0oH1cdhK)

https://images2.imgbox.com/a5/eb/9mujX0PF_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/9mujX0PF)

https://images2.imgbox.com/e7/b4/CozH5DZh_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/CozH5DZh)

https://images2.imgbox.com/8d/2c/IX3UOijR_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/IX3UOijR)

https://images2.imgbox.com/d1/c3/qjWuix9B_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/qjWuix9B)

https://images2.imgbox.com/ae/df/zwt3vsDd_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/zwt3vsDd)

https://images2.imgbox.com/36/b4/8GhiOJgk_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/8GhiOJgk)

https://images2.imgbox.com/65/76/LPsFNcpd_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/LPsFNcpd)

https://images2.imgbox.com/0e/c5/S7oF9R98_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/S7oF9R98)

MichaelZWilliamson
26-11-2018, 06:08 AM
Very nice. I didn't know those existed. It must have taken some mods.

Jibz
19-12-2018, 05:15 PM
It was about 3 weeks back that I went looking for .45 ACP rounds. Being short on funds I opted to buy old stock; and I mean really old stock. Some of these were as old as 1945 or so. The .45 ammo that I found were stored by the seller in a pouch and were all dusty and scratchy. While sorting through them I found one round of .455 Auto. lol. Yes a KYNOCH produced single round of .455 Auto. So here are the pics as I thought to measure its dimensions in comparison to a .45 ACP round produced by S&B.

https://images2.imgbox.com/dd/ef/KsWAz2Du_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/KsWAz2Du)

And here is the .455 Auto placed side by side with a .45 ACP. [The below pictured .45 ACP (on right) is not S&B rather REM-UMC]
https://images2.imgbox.com/76/3b/bO9CDnYC_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/bO9CDnYC)

https://images2.imgbox.com/09/6f/elwOU5JC_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/elwOU5JC)

In addition I took some other measurements of both the cartridges and here are the details.

https://images2.imgbox.com/bd/33/UW56EdG5_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/UW56EdG5)

https://images2.imgbox.com/0f/54/1GRmzBJ5_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/1GRmzBJ5)

.455 Auto case is almost half mm larger than .45 ACP.

https://images2.imgbox.com/18/ab/n00SqcUD_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/n00SqcUD)

https://images2.imgbox.com/8a/c7/o7zTzoGR_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/o7zTzoGR)

The bullet diameter is also larger in case of .455 Auto.


https://images2.imgbox.com/e8/43/V8QN7hjt_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/V8QN7hjt)

https://images2.imgbox.com/fe/d3/Uge3K48r_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/Uge3K48r)

.455 Auto being a semi rimmed cartridge has a larger rim than .45 ACP.

https://images2.imgbox.com/c3/4c/yzGRD0PH_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/yzGRD0PH)

https://images2.imgbox.com/b2/b2/P9CVIFwo_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/P9CVIFwo)

The case diameter is also larger in case of .455 Auto.

https://images2.imgbox.com/86/d5/7C3NYRvA_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/7C3NYRvA)

https://images2.imgbox.com/33/56/920Bbdn8_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/920Bbdn8)

The overall length is the only aspect in which .45 ACP is longer than .455 Auto.

Jibz
19-02-2019, 06:15 PM
Around a week back I visited DAK and found only 3 rounds of .455 Auto. The headstamps stated that one was Eley (production year 1917) and two were from 1918 (Eley). Out of these 3 rounds, only one managed to fire (production year 1918) through the Colt M1911. The other 2 had quite deep firing pin strike imprints on their primers but they didn’t go off. Well, what else would one expect from a 100 year old ammo?

To check the potency of the round I was shooting at a Human Torso size target from 100 meters and you can see in the video (which I am trying to upload but am unsuccessful due to some crappy reason) that the bullet fell at around 70 meters or so. I am pretty confident that it was neither the handgun nor the shooter but the century old round itself that fell only half the distance from where it was intended to land. Its propellant must have lived through its good days.

The pictures of the rounds and the headstamps.
https://images2.imgbox.com/1d/2e/pQYEMK6E_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/pQYEMK6E)

The center one proved its might, somewhat. hahahaha
https://images2.imgbox.com/c0/02/RflcaKBN_o.jpg (http://imgbox.com/RflcaKBN)

FA226
20-02-2019, 01:39 PM
Thats great atleast you were able to fire it in its orignal caliber now you can find a .45 barrel for it.

Jibz
20-02-2019, 01:57 PM
Thats great atleast you were able to fire it in its orignal caliber now you can find a .45 barrel for it.

JazakAllah Khair Roor. That indeed is the plan. I found a .45 Barrel but its grooves did not look lucrative at all so I gave it a pass.

AK47
20-02-2019, 02:16 PM
"Falling" at 70 mtrs.... Lol!

This means "catch" at 69 mtrs.... Lolzz!

Best luck onwards to. 45 ACP!

FA226
20-02-2019, 06:11 PM
JazakAllah Khair Roor. That indeed is the plan. I found a .45 Barrel but its grooves did not look lucrative at all so I gave it a pass.
I hope you will find one in good condition soon inshaAllah.

pakistanitoup
20-02-2019, 09:10 PM
get a local barrel for it dear.

Moeen
02-04-2019, 05:24 AM
Salam All,
@Jibz - You have truly found a hidden gem. I wouldn't fire it... rather display it. The DAK shop you went to - was it the old guy on the main road - carries a lot of odd ammo? If not then visit him - I cannot remember his name, I do remember his shop was on the right side coming from Peshawar after Asia Arms store and more near Haji Rahim Shah's shop but in the main road. He also has or had a lot of .22cb caps i remember. Either way, great job.

Enigmatic Desires
03-04-2019, 10:19 AM
Well. a WW 1 weapon mated to a WW1 round. thier short lived reltionship must have made em cry tears of joy. No wonder the round did not go far from her beloved weapon..

Waisay I am very curious. how on earth do the good people of DAK nestled miles away from anywhere. .manage to get such stuff..

jonnyc
05-04-2019, 04:33 AM
When I saw what you were doing to a fine old collectible I almost started crying, but your finished job is absolutely beautiful. You do excellent work. I love the old 1911s, much more "old school" and elegant than the 1911A1.
About 2 years ago I had 3 boxes of the .455 Auto ammo, each 10 rounds I think. I sold them all quickly for a very good price. I usually see 3-5 or them at cartridge collector shows. I wish I could send loaded rounds to you.

Jibz
05-04-2019, 11:25 AM
"Falling" at 70 mtrs.... Lol!
This means "catch" at 69 mtrs.... Lolzz!
Best luck onwards to. 45 ACP!
Sir, the literal SHORTFALL of the round got me CAUGHT off-guard. lolz. Cheers for the well wishes. I shall keep you all updated inshAllah.


I hope you will find one in good condition soon inshaAllah.
JazakAllah Khair, Roor.


get a local barrel for it dear.
Yes dear, a local barrel could solve the "rare ammo availability" issue, however, genuine .45 barrels in good condition are not that scarce. Hopefully a good deal would pop up soon InshAllah.


Salam All,
@Jibz - You have truly found a hidden gem. I wouldn't fire it... rather display it. The DAK shop you went to - was it the old guy on the main road - carries a lot of odd ammo? If not then visit him - I cannot remember his name, I do remember his shop was on the right side coming from Peshawar after Asia Arms store and more near Haji Rahim Shah's shop but in the main road. He also has or had a lot of .22cb caps i remember. Either way, great job.
Most manana sir. Yes that's exactly him sir, Raikhon Haji. No doubt, he has the most rare ammo I have come across and on top of it, unlike many others I have met, he actually knows about cartridges.


Well. a WW 1 weapon mated to a WW1 round. thier short lived reltionship must have made em cry tears of joy. No wonder the round did not go far from her beloved weapon..
Waisay I am very curious. how on earth do the good people of DAK nestled miles away from anywhere. .manage to get such stuff..
lol @ your dramatization. :laugh: :laugh:. And as to how these DAK people get their hands on such items, I too am simply baffled.


When I saw what you were doing to a fine old collectible I almost started crying, but your finished job is absolutely beautiful. You do excellent work. I love the old 1911s, much more "old school" and elegant than the 1911A1.
About 2 years ago I had 3 boxes of the .455 Auto ammo, each 10 rounds I think. I sold them all quickly for a very good price. I usually see 3-5 or them at cartridge collector shows. I wish I could send loaded rounds to you.
I am glad the finished product put a stop to your crying. hahhahaha. Just Kidding. Many thanks for the compliments, I am honored. And I totally agree that the Old School 1911 are in a league of their own. Also, cheers for the kind gesture of sending the ammo, but alas, owing to the current situation in our country, thats not possible even if they had been available with you.
Regards

TRX
04-05-2020, 01:09 AM
only one managed to fire (production year 1918) through the Colt M1911. The other 2 had quite deep firing pin strike imprints on their primers but they didn’t go off. Well, what else would one expect from a 100 year old ammo?

The first priming compounds used mercury, then various chlorates, and sometimes both. The problem with the mercury-containing priming compounds is that they have a limited shelf life, some of them only a few years, and they lose potency. Those primers probably expired in your grandfather's day.

Starting shortly after yours were made, and for something like 75 years, there were only two priming compounds: potassium chlorate (corrosive) and lead styphnate (non-corrosive). Both worked quite well; chlorate primers work correctly at any temperature from boiling hot to well below freezing, while the lead styphnate primers vary in power ("brisance" is the technical term) by temperature, which is why military ballistics charts for non-corrosive primers have temperature corrections. Countries using corrosive chlorate primers just ignored that sort of thing, besides, cleaning runs kept soldiers out of trouble.

In the 1990s, mostly in the USA due to "environmental" politics, there was a push to eliminate lead from primers. There are half a dozen compounds that made it to market, some of them also with very short shelf lives. Now there are only a couple. None of them are available to reloaders, not that we'd want them anyway. Some of them had odd-sized primer pockets or were very temperature sensitive. Despite the continuing push from government agencies, the vast majority of primers are still lead styphnate.

TRX
04-05-2020, 01:14 AM
By the way, the nearly-hemispherical noses of the .455 bullets are quite common for British ammunition designed from the late 1800s to the early 1900s, both for military and civilian applications. The shape was virtually unknown for American-designed bullets.

I've never seen any explanation as to why it was so popular. I suspect it might have been something simple, like Kynoch or some other large vendor being tooled up to make that shape in vast quantities, therefore that shape was used because it was cheap and available. But that's just a speculation with no evidence to back it up.

Enigmatic Desires
26-05-2020, 11:57 AM
The first priming compounds used mercury, then various chlorates, and sometimes both. The problem with the mercury-containing priming compounds is that they have a limited shelf life, some of them only a few years, and they lose potency. Those primers probably expired in your grandfather's day.

Starting shortly after yours were made, and for something like 75 years, there were only two priming compounds: potassium chlorate (corrosive) and lead styphnate (non-corrosive). Both worked quite well; chlorate primers work correctly at any temperature from boiling hot to well below freezing, while the lead styphnate primers vary in power ("brisance" is the technical term) by temperature, which is why military ballistics charts for non-corrosive primers have temperature corrections. Countries using corrosive chlorate primers just ignored that sort of thing, besides, cleaning runs kept soldiers out of trouble.

In the 1990s, mostly in the USA due to "environmental" politics, there was a push to eliminate lead from primers. There are half a dozen compounds that made it to market, some of them also with very short shelf lives. Now there are only a couple. None of them are available to reloaders, not that we'd want them anyway. Some of them had odd-sized primer pockets or were very temperature sensitive. Despite the continuing push from government agencies, the vast majority of primers are still lead styphnate.

Thanks for your feebdback TRX.. I had no idea that there were so many primer compounds around.