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  1. #1
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    Please advise on Hand gun

    Dear Pakgunners, AoA.

    1. Please advise on buying a compact pistol (max. 4" barrel) for a budget of around 2 lac.
    2. I am located in Karachi, is it worth traveling to other cities to get a better price or selection (have MOI ).
    3. Within Karachi, if you were to pick one area/shop for best selection and price, what would that be?

    Thanks in advance.
    “I carry a Gun because COP is too heavy”

  2. #2
    Member Emeritus Enigmatic Desires's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saif View Post
    Dear Pakgunners, AoA.

    1. Please advise on buying a compact pistol (max. 4" barrel) for a budget of around 2 lac.
    2. I am located in Karachi, is it worth traveling to other cities to get a better price or selection (have MOI ).
    3. Within Karachi, if you were to pick one area/shop for best selection and price, what would that be?

    Thanks in advance.
    4 inches will get you a cedent mdium suzed weapon. In terms of compact weapons, I prefe rthe NP 42 and its mini countperart. Not very fancy to look at, but with a decocker, manual safety, loaded chamber indicator, accassory rail, smallish size, easy to fill mags ( you just push the round down into it) polymer frame (light waight) and a small pouch ful of spare parts, its as good a deal as you can get in these times. Its 120-125k NIB, Slightly less expensive used. Its also used by the Chinese Army as their own tried and tested design.

    However, on the minus side, its not very pretty to look at. And disassembling is a pain. Other than that, she is as good a bang for the buck as any.

    if you want a Turk, then the Salizilmarz 2000 Is a top level platform. Mos people graduate from the NP to the Salzilmarz. it has no decocker, no rail, no loaded chamber indicator and it big and heavy. But if you are into competition shooting on a tight budget, then its a great weapon. But its big and heavy.

    If you just want a super sub compact for deep concealment than the CF mini as well as the Taurus 709 are in your budget. I personaly cant hit the broad side of a barn with either because of the massive recoil. And they cannot be used with +p ammo. But they are both small enough to be carried behind your wallet in your back pocket.
    I generally purchase from Javed armoury these days at maion Lucky Star sadar Karachi. That's where we go, usually on saturdays
    Last edited by Enigmatic Desires; 17-06-2019 at 03:46 PM.
    "Keep a complete control over your Temper and Anger because I never found anything more beneficial at the end and producing more good results then such a control" Hazrat Ali (A.S) tz.enigmatic@gmail.com

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    Tahir Bhai...Bethak change kurlee hai apnai kiya? I have heard you usually spend your sundays at HM Traders.
    Saif: If you are on 200k budget, go for CF98/Np42. they are best in this range. Last week visited Lucky Star and got the price of 95k-100k for np42 mini from HM Traders. Use POF green primer bullets with it and your life will be easy.

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    Member Emeritus Enigmatic Desires's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by a.basit94 View Post
    Tahir Bhai...Bethak change kurlee hai apnai kiya? I have heard you usually spend your sundays at HM Traders.
    Saif: If you are on 200k budget, go for CF98/Np42. they are best in this range. Last week visited Lucky Star and got the price of 95k-100k for np42 mini from HM Traders. Use POF green primer bullets with it and your life will be easy.
    Yes. I did. Now I case the market for the best possible price options instead of relying on one or two dealers alone. With prices sky rocking on a weekly basis I have little choice.

    However, I wold not advise POf's fiocchi shiny golden ammo for CF mini. Its a plus P round meant for the army's MP 5 in rock and roll mode. I have seen it mess up at least two NP 42 mini pistols at the range. However, it eats regular POF with aplomb.
    "Keep a complete control over your Temper and Anger because I never found anything more beneficial at the end and producing more good results then such a control" Hazrat Ali (A.S) tz.enigmatic@gmail.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Enigmatic Desires View Post
    Yes. I did. Now I case the market for the best possible price options instead of relying on one or two dealers alone. With prices sky rocking on a weekly basis I have little choice.

    However, I wold not advise POf's fiocchi shiny golden ammo for CF mini. Its a plus P round meant for the army's MP 5 in rock and roll mode. I have seen it mess up at least two NP 42 mini pistols at the range. However, it eats regular POF with aplomb.
    How's the NP-42 mini ? I was offered a NIB piece in Peshawar for below 90k. I passed on it, because of the low mag capacity, and my dealer in Pindi also advised against getting the mini version.
    "morior invictus" (Death before defeat )

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    Member Emeritus Enigmatic Desires's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by malik94 View Post
    How's the NP-42 mini ? I was offered a NIB piece in Peshawar for below 90k. I passed on it, because of the low mag capacity, and my dealer in Pindi also advised against getting the mini version.
    All super sub compacts have log mag capacity.. They are designed for deep concealment primarily, not high cap. The mini works fine. But not with +p. Few sub compacts do. Generally people try and use local over loaded rounds in it. It starts giving hiccups. Use POF green flag wali rounds and you should be good to go.
    "Keep a complete control over your Temper and Anger because I never found anything more beneficial at the end and producing more good results then such a control" Hazrat Ali (A.S) tz.enigmatic@gmail.com

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Enigmatic Desires View Post
    However, I wold not advise POf's fiocchi shiny golden ammo for CF mini. Its a plus P round meant for the army's MP 5 in rock and roll mode. I have seen it mess up at least two NP 42 mini pistols at the range. However, it eats regular POF with aplomb.
    I've never tried any POF 9mm ammo (yet) except knowing what I read about it over here, and also so far I've only used imported ammo only. I've seen Fiocchi version, but what is the regular POF ammo? The one with the green flag pic on the box ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MK47 View Post
    I've never tried any POF 9mm ammo (yet) except knowing what I read about it over here, and also so far I've only used imported ammo only. I've seen Fiocchi version, but what is the regular POF ammo? The one with the green flag pic on the box ?
    Hanh Hanh bilkul bilkul ^

    (Yes Yes, definitely definitely ^)

    You will recognize the +p just by looking at it. Even wiohtout the packing. its just sooooooo Pretttyyyy.. All nice shiny golden golden..

    (However, I still wont run it through my NP 42) If you have somethign like the full steel forged Salsilmarz 2000, hten YOu might really like it a lot
    Last edited by Enigmatic Desires; 19-06-2019 at 09:59 AM.
    "Keep a complete control over your Temper and Anger because I never found anything more beneficial at the end and producing more good results then such a control" Hazrat Ali (A.S) tz.enigmatic@gmail.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by MK47 View Post
    I've never tried any POF 9mm ammo (yet) except knowing what I read about it over here, and also so far I've only used imported ammo only. I've seen Fiocchi version, but what is the regular POF ammo? The one with the green flag pic on the box ?
    Two variants of 9 mm ammo available with POF one for pistol and other for Mp5. Don’t ever use Mp5 ammo in pistols it’s v heavy bullets.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enigmatic Desires View Post
    Yes. I did. Now I case the market for the best possible price options instead of relying on one or two dealers alone. With prices sky rocking on a weekly basis I have little choice.

    However, I wold not advise POf's fiocchi shiny golden ammo for CF mini. Its a plus P round meant for the army's MP 5 in rock and roll mode. I have seen it mess up at least two NP 42 mini pistols at the range. However, it eats regular POF with aplomb.
    IMHO, POF's green primer rounds are not not +P they are normal 124 grains round. If it is having mess with NP42, then may be 124 grains bullet is not suitable for same.

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    Member Emeritus Enigmatic Desires's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nauman_12345 View Post
    IMHO, POF's green primer rounds are not not +P they are normal 124 grains round. If it is having mess with NP42, then may be 124 grains bullet is not suitable for same.
    Actually they are another version of the 2Z ammo that is meant exclusively for full auto MP5 weapons. The recoil is much much stiffer that its 1z counterparts.
    "Keep a complete control over your Temper and Anger because I never found anything more beneficial at the end and producing more good results then such a control" Hazrat Ali (A.S) tz.enigmatic@gmail.com

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    MP5 is Fiocchi
    "Keep a complete control over your Temper and Anger because I never found anything more beneficial at the end and producing more good results then such a control" Hazrat Ali (A.S) tz.enigmatic@gmail.com

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    Thank you all for your comments.
    So far my understanding is, that 200K isn't probably enough to get a CC friendly gun that is popular. If I'm right, please do make a recommendation for higher cost one. I can afford more but thought that I shouldn't buy something too expensive, just compact, reliable, and easy to maintain is all I am looking for.
    No one attempted my #2 question, it may have violated the etiquette of the forum or I'm being simply stupid. Either way, something to learn for me.
    “I carry a Gun because COP is too heavy”

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    Member Emeritus Enigmatic Desires's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saif View Post
    Thank you all for your comments.
    So far my understanding is, that 200K isn't probably enough to get a CC friendly gun that is popular. If I'm right, please do make a recommendation for higher cost one. I can afford more but thought that I shouldn't buy something too expensive, just compact, reliable, and easy to maintain is all I am looking for.
    No one attempted my #2 question, it may have violated the etiquette of the forum or I'm being simply stupid. Either way, something to learn for me.
    200k is more than adequate for your budget. All Chinese, Turks and Brazilians are in your budget. We gave you our recommendations based on our experience. The only subcompact I know beyond this price range and below the 450k+ category is the CZ Rami. And it does not work well with its own 14 rounder mags. So i did not recommend it.

    The Canik Shark fc compact is also well under 200k. Then there is the Croatian HS 2000 (aka DX (extreme duty ) compact version. (Albeit not my first preference)

    Popularity is based on a lot of things. I once had a very very pretty .32 SnW long revolver.. All steel and ivory.. Anyone who saw it well in love wiht it.

    Then Glocks are worth 600k cause they are well... Glocks. the fact that they are worth the same as most other handguns all over the world is irreverent and they remain wildly popular here cause its a glaaack. For me a gun has to be functional, accurate and reliable out of the box. The Chinese and the Turks are all of the above.

    #question two .. No
    Last edited by Enigmatic Desires; 21-06-2019 at 09:44 AM.
    "Keep a complete control over your Temper and Anger because I never found anything more beneficial at the end and producing more good results then such a control" Hazrat Ali (A.S) tz.enigmatic@gmail.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Enigmatic Desires View Post
    200k is more than adequate for your budget. All Chinese, Turks and Brazilians are in your budget. We gave you our recommendations based on our experience. The only subcompact I know beyond this price range and below the 450k+ category is the CZ Rami. And it does not work well with its own 14 rounder mags. So i did not recommend it.

    The Canik Shark fc compact is also well under 200k. Then there is the Croatian HS 2000 (aka DX (extreme duty ) compact version. (Albeit not my first preference)

    Popularity is based on a lot of things. I once had a very very pretty .32 SnW long revolver.. All steel and ivory.. Anyone who saw it well in love wiht it.

    Then Glocks are worth 600k cause they are well... Glocks. the fact that they are worth the same as most other handguns all over the world is irreverent and they remain wildly popular here cause its a glaaack. For me a gun has to be functional, accurate and reliable out of the box. The Chinese and the Turks are all of the above.

    #question two .. No
    By the way how much is the hs2000 and any reason why would you not prefer it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FA226 View Post
    By the way how much is the hs2000 and any reason why would you not prefer it.
    It was around 250k or so, last I checked. Around dec. And i dont like the HS for the same reason I dont like the glock. Lcck of manual safety and decocker and the fact that I want to see a nice big hammer smacking the living daylights out of every primer it encounters.

    Put simply, I prefer hammers over strikers any day of the week. I once saw an NIB Salsilmarz ST 9 at the range. This young couple had bought it for 125k and it had weak strike issues. Their first gun.

    They were almost in tears wth the lady going "Please fire naa. please" at the gun. Again and again. Deathrow gave em his Salzilmarz Klinic 200 and the hammer went at those Chinese 311 round primers like a duck to water.

    At to that the fact that most striker fired weapons dont have double strike capability. If the round does not fire, you have to manually rack the slide and insert a fresh round. In case of a pistol. with a hammer. You simply cock it by hand (for a single action ) or just press the trigger (in case of a double action).
    "Keep a complete control over your Temper and Anger because I never found anything more beneficial at the end and producing more good results then such a control" Hazrat Ali (A.S) tz.enigmatic@gmail.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Enigmatic Desires View Post
    It was around 250k or so, last I checked. Around dec. And i dont like the HS for the same reason I dont like the glock. Lcck of manual safety and decocker and the fact that I want to see a nice big hammer smacking the living daylights out of every primer it encounters.

    Put simply, I prefer hammers over strikers any day of the week. I once saw an NIB Salsilmarz ST 9 at the range. This young couple had bought it for 125k and it had weak strike issues. Their first gun.

    They were almost in tears wth the lady going "Please fire naa. please" at the gun. Again and again. Deathrow gave em his Salzilmarz Klinic 200 and the hammer went at those Chinese 311 round primers like a duck to water.

    At to that the fact that most striker fired weapons dont have double strike capability. If the round does not fire, you have to manually rack the slide and insert a fresh round. In case of a pistol. with a hammer. You simply cock it by hand (for a single action ) or just press the trigger (in case of a double action).
    That's why all my 9mm pistols are SA/DA now a day's some times I carry my cz75b and some times 92fs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Enigmatic Desires View Post
    It was around 250k or so, last I checked. Around dec. And i dont like the HS for the same reason I dont like the glock. Lcck of manual safety and decocker and the fact that I want to see a nice big hammer smacking the living daylights out of every primer it encounters.

    Put simply, I prefer hammers over strikers any day of the week. I once saw an NIB Salsilmarz ST 9 at the range. This young couple had bought it for 125k and it had weak strike issues. Their first gun.

    They were almost in tears wth the lady going "Please fire naa. please" at the gun. Again and again. Deathrow gave em his Salzilmarz Klinic 200 and the hammer went at those Chinese 311 round primers like a duck to water.

    At to that the fact that most striker fired weapons dont have double strike capability. If the round does not fire, you have to manually rack the slide and insert a fresh round. In case of a pistol. with a hammer. You simply cock it by hand (for a single action ) or just press the trigger (in case of a double action).
    That is up to one's personal preference. The ST9 has some manufacturing faults and was not well executed from the factory. Glocks and even it's other turkish counterpart such as the TP9, don't have such problems and are very reliable.

    But I too personally like the wonder nines over these polymer offerings.
    "morior invictus" (Death before defeat )

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    Enthusiast malik94's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saif View Post
    Thank you all for your comments.
    So far my understanding is, that 200K isn't probably enough to get a CC friendly gun that is popular. If I'm right, please do make a recommendation for higher cost one. I can afford more but thought that I shouldn't buy something too expensive, just compact, reliable, and easy to maintain is all I am looking for.
    No one attempted my #2 question, it may have violated the etiquette of the forum or I'm being simply stupid. Either way, something to learn for me.
    Bro a lot of CC friendly guns fall within your budget & with money to spare. These include the steogar cougar. The compact pistols made by Canik, which are based on the CZ design, such as the C100 and the shark c.

    There are also a few polymer frame options such the NP-42 and it's mini version, the Smith & Wesson sigma and the Tara TM9. The latter two are virtually Glocks and full sized pistols, but some people do manage to carry them. There's also the Canik TP9.

    Concerning the answer to question 2, I have observed that because of the long-standing import ban, prices these days are more or less the same throughout the country. If something you want is not available in Karachi, then you should go to other cities, otherwise there's no benefit.
    Last edited by malik94; 21-06-2019 at 10:30 AM.
    "morior invictus" (Death before defeat )

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    Thank you Enigmatic Desires & malik94.

    I have enough info now to visit some dealers in Saddar. Will share the pics of my pick.

    Again thank you for sharing your experience and expertise.
    “I carry a Gun because COP is too heavy”

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