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Malik
12-01-2009, 11:50 PM
DID ANYBODY HEAR ABOUT DANGEROUS CHEETAH FAMILY,S PRESENCE WITHIN FORESTS OF ABBOTABAD?

Omkhan
13-01-2009, 11:33 AM
Well even if its there , kindly dont HUNT it :)

Sohail
13-01-2009, 03:26 PM
:), ok, then one can go at least to see them.

BTW i have heard that number of good hunting places (specially in Sindh) are already under control of Arabs who comes 1-2 times in a year?

regards to all

sohail



if you are not part of the solution - you are part of the problem.

Firepower!
13-01-2009, 03:33 PM
Cheetah's are illegal to hunt

Cap1
13-01-2009, 09:06 PM
@Sohail I'm not into hunting (yet) but yes Arabs are big time into it they have special storage garages in Karachi just to keep their vehicles.

Syed
13-01-2009, 09:21 PM
i saw a pair of cheetah in 1997 on main road near natya galee while coming from muree to natya galee at mid night

Malik
14-01-2009, 03:28 AM
dear brothers i have heard from someone that there are many dangerous cheetah or leopards who have killed some people in the area of abbotabbad . i myself read it in some newspaper couples of month ago. but also read that some people did not like it to be spread so m asking if any body heard of it?

Abbas
14-01-2009, 03:42 AM
Every two years or so a story like that is reported and is mostly true. A think a few years back they even organized a hunt for the mankiller cheetah. It was in the Abbotabad area as well.

Till a few years ago Cheetaz etc were a common sight in Murree, often soaking in the sun rays watching people go by on the nearby Chairlift or peacefully playing with it's cubs.

Omkhan
14-01-2009, 10:17 AM
Most cheetah attacks in galiyat were by mother cheetah who acted in the defence of its cub. thats what the papers wrote. Yes, Arabs have a big hand in mostly illegal hunting of precious birds & deers. e.g. they r very fond of "talur" which they think increases their .. well sexual power. They have hunted it badly here & it is almost vanished. Most of these arabs hunt in Thar & near Ghotki I believe where Mehrs live. Mehr family r one of the big hosts to these Arab Shaikhs

Malik
15-01-2009, 02:21 PM
ARABS R HUNTING ALL OVER PAKISTAN . BEERS IN KASMIR R SAFE BCOZ OF BORDER PROBLEMS,OTHERWISE THEY WERE ALSO GONE.DID ANY BODY HEAR THAT WILD LIFE PEOPLE R TRYING TP STABLE THE POPULATION OF CHEETAH FAMILY IN ABBOTABAD?

Firepower!
17-01-2009, 12:10 AM
need to stop arabs from plundering our reserves.

Abbas
17-01-2009, 01:12 AM
Yeah we need to hunt em ourselves ;)

TAREEN
17-01-2009, 06:46 AM
AOA, All.

Although slightly drifting away from the main topic, the discussion came to an interesting point, i.e., ‘Presence of Arab aristocracy in Pakistan for hunting’. I have some things to add to the topic which I thought should be there as most of the readers will be already knowledgeable about it.
Arabs do come here for hunting & have kind of leased the patches in Sindh & Baluchistan known for breeding & transit of local & migrating birds. For animals, its Cholistan. I agree to the fact that they hunt for recreation, but it ends there. What happens in the background of these headlines is that they spend billions annually (its not exaggerated) for the care, breeding & safety of these birds & animals. The money they end up spending here partially goes directly to our government & mainly disseminates among the local community. Few of the obvious expenditures are the local people getting jobs as caretakers, guides & staff all year round working together with local law enforcement agencies to stop illegal hunting & poaching. They have spent a fortune in form of dedicated vehicles, civil structures, staff & special allowances to help these birds & animals breed & grow in number in the wild & at the same time stop illegal killing. There are lots of people who make their living truly saving wildlife.

In my personal opinion, the money spent on the safety & breeding environment of these things ha no comparison to the very few birds they hunt off the breeding season. Secondly, wild animals & birds are not endangered by the likes of those who are learned & with vision as the members of this club but those who make their living killing them in bulk & selling them just as expensive and rare meat.

Abbas
17-01-2009, 11:52 AM
I totally agree with Tareen's post. The Arab's who come to hunt here do provide a lot of services to the local communities in forms of jobs, free hospitals, schools etc. Also they are unobtrusive unlike our leaders who if they want to pass a road put everyone else's life on hold.

These guys will be living there and hunting for a week and no one from that area will even know. Another thing to mention is that these people generally hunt with Falcons rather than Guns.

Malik
17-01-2009, 03:31 PM
and i wonder if tareen sb know about the arab palace of rahim yar khan, what happens there

TAREEN
17-01-2009, 05:46 PM
Dear Malik Sb., although its their personal matter like everyone else's, I would still love to know about the inside story of the Arab palace...like most of other readers :)

Gun Lover
25-01-2009, 10:05 AM
Do not hunt big cats
they are endangered
they only attack humans when there is no choice
mostly b/c of very bad health or like

no news on human attack after nathiagali incident
locals killed several after finally killing the original culprit
it was earlier hit by a vehicle had his teeth broken
and then resorted to humans for easy soft meal

Abbas
25-01-2009, 11:58 AM
Keep on topic guys.. this one is about hunting in Abbotabad not the personal lives of arab princes.

TAREEN
25-01-2009, 01:06 PM
rightly said...

Firepower!
25-01-2009, 01:18 PM
What sort of game is there in Abbottabad to hunt?

I would say that you probably have to move up in the mountains to find anything decent.

If any one is from there, he may be able to organize a small gathering there.

Malik
26-01-2009, 05:32 AM
actually i was silent and thinking if tareen sb want me banned by admin after my reply :D

Malik
26-01-2009, 05:39 AM
my many friends here r against this hunt but i will sincerely advise that if any body likes hiking then plz donot forget ur weapon while on the way to galliyat from abbotabbad or from thandyani to abottabad or thandyani to galliyat.(off road)

TAREEN
26-01-2009, 07:46 AM
Dear Malik Sb., pls let me elaborate on my remarks & have no hard feelings. I'm sure u'll take it lightly as we r all brothers here to share our experiences. As nicely put by Firepower! in another thread that the discussion should be within the parameters of of the original subject so the one looking for relevant information doesn't miss anything. I stand corrected myself to drift the subject from original topic. BTW Arabs have been an interesting subject from Hollywood to commoner because of their extravagance. They have to be extraordinary as they belong to an extraordinary place.

Malik
26-01-2009, 08:08 PM
i accept tareen sb:cool:

Ka_Khan
02-02-2009, 09:00 PM
Once i have the experience of Hunting in Mansehra area (north of Abbottabad).But not cheata's but ducks !!
Some years back the people hunted down a poor and hungry cheata in the 'Nawasher' area of abbottabad.
The poor creature came down from the side of Shimla Hill.It was locked in a house and killed !!

TAREEN
03-02-2009, 10:19 AM
Locked & killed... This is not HUNTING! Its is killing :)

Firepower!
04-02-2009, 02:28 PM
The folks who did this should be brought to justice.

Saeen
04-02-2009, 05:59 PM
Total brutality


..... hunted down a poor and hungry cheata in the 'Nawasher' area of abbottabad.


On the lighter side i would love to see a rich and well-fed cheetah ;)

Cap1
04-02-2009, 06:31 PM
i would love to see a rich and well-fed cheetah
Namibia's the place to go sir!

Ka_Khan
04-02-2009, 06:54 PM
Dont Send him to Namibia otherwise cheata's there will also become 'poor and hungry'!!!
To continue.........Today (4-2-9)Urdu Newspaper "Ajj Kal" story,"people have spotted a cheata in the foothills of Shimla pahare and have CALLED the wildlife department for action.Lets hope they come up with something to catch it not to kill it.

Sikander Panhwar
09-02-2009, 11:50 AM
dear friends cheetas r the only african specie. they r comon asian leopards.regards

Ka_Khan
09-02-2009, 06:55 PM
Yes Leopards but the Locals call it 'Sheer".

Glxspk
09-04-2009, 04:17 AM
Yeah we need to hunt em ourselves ;)

Who cheetahs or Arabs :P

Glxspk
09-04-2009, 04:21 AM
Total brutality


..... hunted down a poor and hungry cheata in the 'Nawasher' area of abbottabad.


On the lighter side i would love to see a rich and well-fed cheetah ;)

What would you call a female version of that walking on two legs. :P

I'll opt to see that ;)

Bullseye
09-04-2009, 01:50 PM
+1 to Sikandar..........

These are not Cheetahs, but Leopards.

Ka_Khan
10-04-2009, 07:45 PM
@Glxspk..........Rabz !

jigss
17-09-2010, 10:04 PM
there was a story of a man eater near abotabad few ears back which was hunted down by wild life people...they even announced a price for that cheeta as well but that was few years back n their was permission for that as well... so if there is a man eater out there the wildlife guys will take care of it or will let us knw if they needed any help... brother i will sincerely advice all who are thinking abt hunting these poor animals (leopards) that not to hunt them coz there are already people in these areas who hunt them for the sake of money as there meat n skin is very expensive.
beside that i did heard that there are rabbits in the outskirts of abbottabad but didnt get the chance 2 find out if its true or not.... :rolleyes:

Ahmed Sultan
18-09-2010, 12:22 PM
dear friends cheetas r the only african specie. they r comon asian leopards.regards

Sikander Bhai, this is not true. There is an animal called Asiatic Cheetah, looks exactly the same as African Cheetah and is still found today in Iran. There are confirmed report of Asiatic Cheetah on the plains on Makran Range as late as 1980s. If you go there and talk to the old local hunters they call the common Leopard "Cheetah" as well, but they tell that there use to be another type of cheetah that was different from the current one, it had paws like dog i.e. without retractable claws and was much slimmer and use to chase down gazelles. From the world mamals guide, the historic Asiatic Cheetah range use to be through out the plains of Indian Subcontinent.

Arslan_tareen
18-09-2010, 12:42 PM
1+ Ahmad bahi , contrary to common belief there is and has always been a Asiatic cheetah and Asiatic loins aswl a bit smaller then its african brothers in fact in older and golden days they use to be trained to hunt rabbits and small deer actually the confusing mixing of the names can be traced even to that times as it use to known as HUNTING LEOPARD at that time , there are many vintage videos where rajas have been seen Hunting with cheetahs in a same way falconry is done now a days . sadly though its thought to be extinct in Pakistan and is brink of extinction in iran . the Lion is long gone from Pakistan and is now only preserved in one national park of India in Gir forest Gujrat . if only our ancestors understood the meaning of preservation for the next generation sadly nor do most of us .

Afzaal
27-09-2010, 11:06 AM
1+ Ahmad bahi , contrary to common belief there is and has always been a Asiatic cheetah and Asiatic loins aswl a bit smaller then its african brothers in fact in older and golden days they use to be trained to hunt rabbits and small deer actually the confusing mixing of the names can be traced even to that times as it use to known as HUNTING LEOPARD at that time , there are many vintage videos where rajas have been seen Hunting with cheetahs in a same way falconry is done now a days . sadly though its thought to be extinct in Pakistan and is brink of extinction in iran . the Lion is long gone from Pakistan and is now only preserved in one national park of India in Gir forest Gujrat . if only our ancestors understood the meaning of preservation for the next generation sadly nor do most of us .


maybe you are talking about this one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NevenDIp95A

Haris
27-09-2010, 11:34 AM
These are leopards (local name Guldar, Tendwa, Cheetah) according to these two sites

http://www.wildlifeofpakistan.com/WildlifeCampaigns/savingthecommonleopardsinpakistan.htm

http://www.nathiagali.com/?page_id=205

marlin vs
27-09-2010, 02:34 PM
Very good video Afzaal, thank you. :)

Sikander Panhwar
27-09-2010, 02:46 PM
ahmed bhai u r right but they r no longer exsists in pakistan,the one captured or killed in the areas they r mentioning r only specie called comon leopard,one of my friend also accidently killed one 3 years ago,but one of these days there r no cheetas left in pakistan may b in iran im not sure,even the leopard in sind is histrory last was killed by dr rizvi in keethar range.though ppl still say they have vitness in balochistan area but i dont think so,may b one or 2,but no athentic reports.

380ACP
10-07-2013, 12:56 PM
Sikandar bro rightly pointed out that there is no cheetah in abbottabad but himalayan panther or leopard which is also called guldaar, locals call it sher, there have been much debate about leopards and panthers as two different species but actually they are same, panthers live deep in forests while leopards in the outskirts of villages and feed on dogs, rabbits,jungle fowl they have a dark coat as compared to those who live in outskirts of villages panthers also grow larger because of enviroment and diet, ordinary leopards have a light coat which helps themto stalk the prey in th outskirts between rocks and game paths, a maneater after killing 3 children and mauling many others was caught in abbottabad 3 years ago. Hunting leopards is not legal it can get you behund bars for atleast 7 years but still villagers hunt them after getting their cattle devoured,leopards in abbottabad are gugantic as compared to those found in india or africa a large fully grown leopard can reach the length of 9.3 over curves and 9 under curves keeping in mind that the famous man eating leopard of rudraprayag was 7.something when finally shot by jim corbett in 1926, snow leopard which is also the state animal of gilgit baltistan is much smaller as compared to the leopards found in abbottabad and kashmir region, there are chances of asiatic cheeta in balochistan but not confirmed same is the case with asiatic lions. Asiatic lions differ from their counterpartst in gujrat, India and africa. Both species found in gujrat india are much larger than asiatic lions found in iran. Asiatic lions have a very differ3t mane which is very dark and thick. Asiatic lions live in semi-mountaineous places like balochistan and iran. Tigers are long gone from pakistan the last was shot in 1940s but there are un confirmed reports of siberian tigers sighted in north of pakistan according to national geographic and other sources siberian tigers are only left in china and russia, so the presence of the largest cat a siberian tiger is extremely doubtful in the north of pakistan, siberian tiger is also the second largest carnivora after polar bear on planet, estimated number left in forests are 400,

380ACP
10-07-2013, 01:00 PM
sorry for typing mistakes am using phone

Fraz
10-07-2013, 06:32 PM
Sikandar bro rightly pointed out that there is no cheetah in abbottabad but himalayan panther or leopard which is also called guldaar, locals call it sher, there have been much debate about leopards and panthers as two different species but actually they are same, panthers live deep in forests while leopards in the outskirts of villages and feed on dogs, rabbits,jungle fowl they have a dark coat as compared to those who live in outskirts of villages panthers also grow larger because of enviroment and diet, ordinary leopards have a light coat which helps themto stalk the prey in th outskirts between rocks and game paths, a maneater after killing 3 children and mauling many others was caught in abbottabad 3 years ago. Hunting leopards is not legal it can get you behund bars for atleast 7 years but still villagers hunt them after getting their cattle devoured,leopards in abbottabad are gugantic as compared to those found in india or africa a large fully grown leopard can reach the length of 9.3 over curves and 9 under curves keeping in mind that the famous man eating leopard of rudraprayag was 7.something when finally shot by jim corbett in 1926, snow leopard which is also the state animal of gilgit baltistan is much smaller as compared to the leopards found in abbottabad and kashmir region, there are chances of asiatic cheeta in balochistan but not confirmed same is the case with asiatic lions. Asiatic lions differ from their counterpartst in gujrat, India and africa. Both species found in gujrat india are much larger than asiatic lions found in iran. Asiatic lions have a very differ3t mane which is very dark and thick. Asiatic lions live in semi-mountaineous places like balochistan and iran. Tigers are long gone from pakistan the last was shot in 1940s but there are un confirmed reports of siberian tigers sighted in north of pakistan according to national geographic and other sources siberian tigers are only left in china and russia, so the presence of the largest cat a siberian tiger is extremely doubtful in the north of pakistan, siberian tiger is also the second largest carnivora after polar bear on planet, estimated number left in forests are 400,


a very informative post

380ACP
10-07-2013, 09:27 PM
thank you Faraz brother, leopards to some extent are scavangers they will eat anything they come across like the lions in african bush tigers rarely feed on something they have not killd, tigers after killing bites off the tail and makes a cut on the near hind legs and pulls out internals this together they leave at some at least ten feet away before setting down for meal, large panthers are also known to adopt this method while others eat everything, freshly wounded tiger will betray his presence by growling when approached while leopards will stay calm unless you have approached thy will launch a flank or rear attack and if they miss there are very less chance of charging again unless disturbed again, panthers and tigers both have no sense of smell thats the reason they stalk they prey and always launch a rear or flank attack, when a leopard charges there are chance of the victim to survive while the tiger completes the job throughly, thats why most attacks in our hills leaves the victims mauled not killed, the famous leopards in history are maneater of panar, rudraprayag and nagpur, the rudra prayag leopard though responsible for less deaths as compared to panar man eater was the most famous leopard of all time which was published in almost all the daily and weekly in india,britain,usa,nepal,canada, south africa,europe, russia for 8 long years, the reason for being so famous was it was operating in an area in which hindus come from all over india to visit holy places, many pilgrims were mauled some completely devoured for 8 years every effort was made to get rid of this menace even cynide failed to eliminate the leopard Legendary hunter Maj Jim Corbett chased the man eater for one whole year and shot it during his last night/attempt to kill it, it was responsible for 164 deaths the panar man eating leopard was responsible for 450 deaths,

380ACP
10-07-2013, 11:01 PM
other famous man eaters are man eaters of tsavo both lions were maneless and shot dead by John Henry Peterson using a 303 rifle, champwat tigress responsible for 430 human deaths was driven to india by a body of armed men from nepal after she devoured 200 people she continued devouring people in india and finally shot by Major Corbett, chowghar tigress responsible for 64 kills was accompqnied by a full grown cub both were shot by maj Coebett, chuka maneater also shot by Jim Corbett, the thak man eating tigress which was one of the most cunning tigress to deal with was shot dramatically on the last day of Corbett's hunt after failing many time he called the tigress which was in search of mate and assuming that its the male tiger calling for mating came running towards Corbett and was shot when only few seconds of day light was left and Corbett hardly took aim and pulled the trigger of his 500 NE the second barrel discharged accidently making a violent contact with his jaw sending him few feet down over his men and a goat he was 61 years old that time, the chowgarh tigress was shot using a 275 rigby an english term for 7x57 mm, full grown cubs of tallades man eater were also shot by Corbett using the same 275 rigby, kanda man eater, mohan man eater are also shot by corbett,

380ACP
10-07-2013, 11:23 PM
apart from man eaters the bechalor of powalghar and pipal pani tigers were also among his trophies bachelor was famous all over india and every big game hunter failed to bag him the reason for being so famous was his size he was the most enormous tiger of his time and maybe till today he holds the title Corbett shot him after injuring him following his trail for three days at the time time of shooting bachelor was ready for a spring on Corbett, pipal pani tiger was a small cub when Corbett saw him first and shot some years later on the critical moment pipal pani did not come the way Corbett expected him to so he had to let him come closer and shot it when tiger was raising his fore legs to hold Corbett from neck,

380ACP
10-07-2013, 11:39 PM
Jim corbett got his ear drum damaged during a shooting trip when a heavy rifle was discharged by a man sitting behind him on elephant absacess started to form in his head whioe following the tallades tigress after shooting full grown cubs corbett could not use the knowledgeof jungle lore which he learned in many years as he was not able to hear any sound, could not see from one eye and could not move his neck right or left in this condition he followed the wounded tigress for days and finally when was near and at the moment when he was about to take aim the absacess bursted in his head he hardly reached a tree where he remaned unconcious for hours the second day he shot the man eater,

Fraz
11-07-2013, 05:31 PM
Means Maj Jim was a legend himself :) i wish he had used tranquilizers. i have lived in nathia gali for over 3 years and used travel at odd times, like even after midnight but never came across any taindwa (or cheetah what the locals call it). till a decade ago i think it was common to see these taindwas on the road even, after sunset. i think they have either shifted to the thick jungle sides away from the main roads and villages or they're dead :(

380ACP
11-07-2013, 07:27 PM
there is no other man but Jim Corbett who worked day and night to preserve tigers his work was acknowledged and a specie indochinese tiger was named after him panthera tigris corbetti, there was no other way to eliminate the danger to villagers, thats why he had to shoot the tigers when hunters were depending on elephants and beaters to flush the beasts tiwards them Corbett took days long walk deep in forests following man eaters on foot, all man eaters are suffering from some abnormality like the teeth of champwat tigress was missing, man eater of thak was deprived from killing her natural prey after getting shot, chowghar tigress was very old her claws were splashed out and teeth were missing too, as far as your regret Farazbrother that you have never seen a leopard in nathiagali is concerned it does not means you have not been seen by leopards, leopards and tigers have the most keenest hearing in jungles, so when you want to see them make sure you really want to see them, and please take a magnum handgum with you what if they dont like to see you.

Fraz
11-07-2013, 08:05 PM
i do agree with u brother on the point that corbett has done alot for the preservation of wild cats, there is even a national park named after him (india). i often used to hike in the nathia gali, kalabagh, bara gali areas n always had a side arm (mostly a glock 17) with me in those days

Fraz
11-07-2013, 08:14 PM
and thanks for ur concern for my safety :)

380ACP
11-07-2013, 08:58 PM
the ideal time to look for leopards is from 8am to 11am you can find them basking nder sun on rocks, you can also look for them in afternoon when they are out to quench thirst and hunt from mid night to early morning like from 12am to 4am they are less active maybe this is the rule of nature so those who run for life from carnivora can sleep and rest, I am strickly against killng or injuring leopards unless it becomes a threat, but feeling safe with a 9mm handgun is not wise when facing a leopard you can only provoke the beast to attack 44 magnum is the least caliber to think when you are walking in a leopard infested jungle,

Fraz
11-07-2013, 09:03 PM
sir i have what so ever no interest in looking for a leopard in a jungle, i want to live :P . the nathia gali wild life park has a snow leopard aswell

Fraz
11-07-2013, 09:05 PM
and a .357 mag taurus 608 is on my wish list :) when i have enough cash

380ACP
11-07-2013, 09:26 PM
the snow leopard in wild life park is a little different from the leopards found in northeren areas they have a dark coat as compared to the one in nathia gali which has a lighter coat maybe because its not fully grown anyways this leopard was imported to pakistan by the son of chief minister punjab Mian Mohammad Shhbaz Sharif, two cubs were imported from canada later one was gifted to wild life in KPK and other probably died not long ago during the election compaign in lahore, beautiful creatures I had the honour of touching his coat and was amazed to feel the velvet like soft warm coat Mashahallah.

Fraz
11-07-2013, 10:26 PM
the snow leopard in wild life park is a little different from the leopards found in northeren areas they have a dark coat as compared to the one in nathia gali which has a lighter coat maybe because its not fully grown anyways this leopard was imported to pakistan by the son of chief minister punjab Mian Mohammad Shhbaz Sharif, two cubs were imported from canada later one was gifted to wild life in KPK and other probably died not long ago during the election compaign in lahore, beautiful creatures I had the honour of touching his coat and was amazed to feel the velvet like soft warm coat Mashahallah.

it was a good gesture to gift it to the wild life otherwise he might have also been the victim of the campaign in extreme hot temperatures :( sir u surely are lucky to have felt the fur of the cat :)

Masroor
13-07-2013, 09:58 PM
Every two years or so a story like that is reported and is mostly true. A think a few years back they even organized a hunt for the mankiller cheetah. It was in the Abbotabad area as well.

Till a few years ago Cheetaz etc were a common sight in Murree, often soaking in the sun rays watching people go by on the nearby Chairlift or peacefully playing with it's cubs.


Very Nice Info Dear.....................

Masroor
13-07-2013, 10:00 PM
Dears not only In Northeren area Leapords are also In Salt Range area Too. We and Wild Life Deptt.have Confirm Info and Witnesses for there Presence in Salt Range area.