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View Full Version : CZ99 vs CZ999 Scorpion



Mohammad
28-07-2010, 12:06 PM
AOA guys. Need some feedback about comparing these two models.Went to Fakhir-e-Alam to see it. Externally there is not much difference but dont know much about the internal. I am buying one for myself but confused as to which to buy. I have heard that the frame of cz999 is 1.5mm thinner than cz99. Does this effect any performance

Abu Al Hawl
28-07-2010, 12:26 PM
Mohammad bro, go for scorpion.

SPAYPANTHER
28-07-2010, 12:34 PM
only differenc is that " cz99 has a selecter to select revolver and pistol mode...

and yes go for scorpion it is best of the best!!!

Abu Al Hawl
28-07-2010, 12:40 PM
Spaypanther bro, let me correct you, cz 999 scorpion does not have selector switch, its on cz999, there are 2 models one is cz999 and one is cz999 scorpion :D

SPAYPANTHER
28-07-2010, 01:23 PM
@ ABH
thanks bro you are right its my mistake...

but let me also correct you it is not "cz999" it is "cz99" which have selector...:)

Abu Al Hawl
28-07-2010, 01:54 PM
no dear cz99 and cz 999 scorpion does not have, only cz999 has it. please google on the net.

Aquarius
28-07-2010, 01:55 PM
@ ABH
thanks bro you are right its my mistake...

but let me also correct you it is not "cz999" it is "cz99" which have selector...:)

SP brother AAH brother is correct.. CZ99 is the older models and doesn't have a selector.. its the CZ999 which has got selector switch for R and P (R stands for revolver and P for pistol).. it also has a low shot indicator in its grips for the last three rounds.. the CZ999 Scorpion which are being imported here and other Countries and the Charles Dally which are exported to the U.S doesn't have selector switch as well as low shot indicator..... :)

SPAYPANTHER
28-07-2010, 02:08 PM
thanks Aquaries bro i just check it again and understand... and sorry AAH bro:(

Abu Al Hawl
28-07-2010, 02:47 PM
its ok SP ;)

ejazchohan
06-11-2010, 12:42 PM
Which one is preferable? Canik55 or CZ999 Scorpion

Mitho
06-11-2010, 02:34 PM
cz999.

SPAYPANTHER
06-11-2010, 06:39 PM
off course
cz999

zeeshan.pk
06-11-2010, 11:05 PM
pls go for Cz999 scorpion,this is the pistol to buy in this price range,it is better than viking and stooger as for as my perception is concerned,it is like a tank,let me say the real tank

zeeshan.pk
06-11-2010, 11:10 PM
Which one is preferable? Canik55 or CZ999 Scorpion
Cz999 Scorpion,no match at all in this price range

Aquarius
06-11-2010, 11:49 PM
pls go for Cz999 scorpion, it is better than viking

http://s4.postimage.org/S59Qr.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/)

Better than Viking ??

Can you kindly justify and explain why CZ999 is better than Viking zeeshan brother.. :/

Dr Zakir
06-11-2010, 11:54 PM
good experssion sir

AK47
06-11-2010, 11:57 PM
Why don't we shoot a CZ 999 with a Baikal, and then a Baikal with the CZ, to check out which is the actual tank? ;)

Let me put it this way, both are guns, not tanks, only the damned barrel and feed ramp of the Baikal, is like the barrel of the tank! ;)

IMHO Polymer has nothing to do with a tank, and I really wish the barrel of the Viking could get fitted into the body of the CZ999, and you'd then have the ultimate thing. :)

12GAUGE
07-11-2010, 12:44 AM
AoA Everybody

Anywhere I see a CZ 999 vs Baikal MP446 type debate brewing up, I simply cannot resist jumping right in. Kindly allow me to throw in my two cents on the subject.

Baikal MP446 Viking:

From metallurgy standpoint, I do not see a reason not to call it a tank. similarly I do not have a single qualified/researched/authenticated reason to call it a tank. in such case, it is advisable to go forward with the most popular opinion. here we go, everything about this handgun just oozes ruggedness/robustness. someone questioned the shape of the guide rod. I'll say, guides rods are not designed to take enormous amounts of pressure to begin with therefore there is no need for a heavy, solid metal guide rod. on the other hand, Baikal's guide rod is designed (IMHO) in such a way to reduce the chances of spring buckling under load during cycling, possibly increasing reliability. which is a big time plus in my books.

moving on, Baikal's trigger is the best in its class. no need to discuss it any further but CZ 999 Scorpion is not bad at all. infact, DA to SA transition is much more smoother in CZ 999 than in Baikal. baikal's trigger in DA is mode is down right painful.

moving on again, Baikal's chamber clearly speaks that its designed to fire something NASTY. barrel on the other hand is nothing out of the ordinary.

CZ 999 Scorpion

A time proven design that has faced the most critique of consumers and lived to tell the tale, The U.S. consumers.

A design that has seen the rigors of war/conflict. the hardest of any tests. undergone changes afterwards. showing that the product matured and/or incorporated the lessons learned. its been in the market (international) for quiet sometime now. whereas Baikal MP446 Viking has seen no war. it has not been exported to US. it is relatively a newer product. there is no time proven history/track record to backup any claims by Baikal users.

The barrel of the CZ 999 Scorpion is thicker than Baikal MP446 Viking. after measuring both with a vernier caliper, I welcome anybody to reject my statement. another plus, it is chromed lined from inside and outside. some say it is a sign of durability, I'll say not necessarily. but I would rather have inside and outside chroming instead of only inside chroming. both barrels are hammer forged by the way.

the rifling on CZ 999 Scorpion is deep and more profound than on Viking. I do not what that means but I would rather have deep rifling. kinda gives an impression to me that such a barrel would have longer life. but thats only my guestimation. your mileage may vary.

when it comes to handguns, barrel isnt everything. frames are a big variable as well. Baikal's frame is polymer reinforced with steel inserts. so its steel on steel whereas on CZ 999 Scorpion, it is Steel slide on aluminum frame. I would not say, that it is not solid or strong but I will say this that Steel on Steel will always be better than Steel on Aluminum. plus Polymer is maintenance free, where Aluminum is high maintenance.

now coming to controls, Baikal's trigger is the best in its class. but thats not the end of it. there are other controls too that are quiet as important, CZ 999 is supplied with an ambidextrous decocker, slide release and magazine release. this is a big time plus in my opinion. whereas baikal's controls in my opinion are less than impressive. Racking a Baikal not only requires considerable force but also requires you to carefully watch where you are placing your fingers as it has one hell of an ability to leave a permanent mark (in shape of a wound) if you are not careful enough. rough edges and sharp corners are the culprit here. in CZ 999 Scorpion, you may rack the gun with your teeth if want to. smooth as silk and requires very little force. you can even rack the slide by just grabbing the gun with its sights (i'm not recommending it, only saying to make a point).

one more thing I would like to add in defense of CZ 999 Scorpion. take the manual of CZ 999 Scorpion and you'll find the handgun being referred to as a combat handgun whereas in Baikal MP446 Viking's case, it is being referred to as "Sporting and Training Pistol". what does that tell ya? I know :(

Bottom Line (just my humble opinion, I'm not insisting on anything):

in my view, Baikal is all about durability (I'm just going with the most popular opinion) whereas CZ 999 scorpion which (possibly but not necessarily) compromises very little on durability but also takes into consideration comfort as well. in my opinion, comfort and smoothness matters. I'm not saying that durability doesn't. all I'm saying when I go to a store to buy a pair of boots, I buy the ones that are strong and comfy. why don't I go and buy something made of all metal/steel? strong as hell but would rip my feet to shreds. so why should firearms be any different. any tool that we buy should be strong and comfortable as well. strength isn't everything. otherwise we would all be wearing pants made of HDPE and boots made of fiber reinforced polymer or carbon steel instead of leather. a firearm is a complete package. you just cannot/should not focus on any two/three variables and forget the rest.

however, your mileage may vary. this is just my personal opinion. if you desire durability to a point that comfort isn't a necessary trait for you then by all means, Baikal is the way to go. there is no doubt about it. from durability standpoint, it is better than any CZ 999 at any given day (with an unconfirmed but sadly most popular assumption that Baikal is built like a tank, NOT A FACT). however if you desire a more complete package, CZ 999 offers alot more than just durability so do look into it.

Regards.

AK47
07-11-2010, 01:10 AM
AoA Everybody

Anywhere I see a CZ 999 vs Baikal MP446 type debate brewing up, I simply cannot resist jumping right in. Kindly allow me to throw in my two cents on the subject.

Baikal MP446 Viking:

From metallurgy standpoint, I do not see a reason not to call it a tank. similarly I do not have a single qualified/researched/authenticated reason to call it a tank. in such case, it is advisable to go forward with the most popular opinion. here we go, everything about this handgun just oozes ruggedness/robustness. someone questioned the shape of the guide rod. I'll say, guides rods are not designed to take enormous amounts of pressure to begin with therefore there is no need for a heavy, solid metal guide rod. on the other hand, Baikal's guide rod is designed (IMHO) in such a way to reduce the chances of spring buckling under load during cycling, possibly increasing reliability. which is a big time plus in my books.

moving on, Baikal's trigger is the best in its class. no need to discuss it any further but CZ 999 Scorpion is not bad at all. infact, DA to SA transition is much more smoother in CZ 999 than in Baikal. baikal's trigger in DA is mode is down right painful.

moving on again, Baikal's chamber clearly speaks that its designed to fire something NASTY. barrel on the other hand is nothing out of the ordinary.

CZ 999 Scorpion

A time proven design that has faced the most critique of consumers and lived to tell the tale, The U.S. consumers.

A design that has seen the rigors of war/conflict. the hardest of any tests. undergone changes afterwards. showing that the product matured and/or incorporated the lessons learned. its been in the market (international) for quiet sometime now. whereas Baikal MP446 Viking has seen no war. it has not been exported to US. it is relatively a newer product. there is no time proven history/track record to backup any claims by Baikal users.

The barrel of the CZ 999 Scorpion is thicker than Baikal MP446 Viking. after measuring both with a vernier caliper, I welcome anybody to reject my statement. another plus, it is chromed lined from inside and outside. some say it is a sign of durability, I'll say not necessarily. but I would rather have inside and outside chroming instead of only inside chroming. both barrels are hammer forged by the way.

the rifling on CZ 999 Scorpion is deep and more profound than on Viking. I do not what that means but I would rather have deep rifling. kinda gives an impression to me that such a barrel would have longer life. but thats only my guestimation. your mileage may vary.

when it comes to handguns, barrel isnt everything. frames are a big variable as well. Baikal's frame is polymer reinforced with steel inserts. so its steel on steel whereas on CZ 999 Scorpion, it is Steel slide on aluminum frame. I would say, that it is weak but I will say that Steel on Steel will always be better than Steel on Aluminum. plus Polymer is maintenance free, where Aluminum is high maintenance.

now coming to controls, Baikal's trigger is the best in its class. but thats not the end of it. there are other controls too, CZ 999 is supplied with an ambidextrous decocker, slide release and magazine release. this is a big time plus in my opinion. whereas baikal's controls in my opinion are less than impressive.

one more thing I would like to add in defense of CZ 999 Scorpion. take the manual of CZ 999 Scorpion and you'll find the handgun being referred to as a combat handgun whereas in Baikal MP446 Viking's case, it is being referred to as "Sporting and Training Pistol". what does that tell ya? I know :(


Bottom Line (just my humble opinion, I'm not insisting on anything):

in my view, Baikal is all about durability (I'm just going with the most popular opinion) whereas CZ 999 scorpion which (possibly but not necessarily) compromises very little on durability but also takes into consideration comfort as well. in my opinion, comfort and smoothness matters. I'm not saying that durability doesn't. all I'm saying when I go to a store to buy a pair of boots, I buy the ones that are strong and comfy. why don't I go and buy something made of all metal/steel? strong as hell but would rip my feet to shreds. so why should firearms be any different. any tool that we buy should be strong and comfortable as well. strength isn't everything. otherwise we would all be wearing pants made of HDPE and boots made of fiber reinforced polymer or carbon steel instead of leather. a firearm is a complete package. you just cannot/should not focus on any two/three variables and forget the rest.

however, your mileage may vary. this is just my personal opinion. if you desire durability to a point that comfort isn't a necessary trait for you then by all means, Baikal is the way to go. there is no doubt about it. from durability standpoint, it is better than any CZ 999 at any given day. however if you desire a more complete package, CZ 999 offers alot more than just durability so do look into it.

Regards.

@12G.....Excellent writeup bro, I agree with you, as I said above, Polymer cannot ever match steel, IMHO, and would love one day to see even a Glock, all steel! ;) :P

Moreover, I have not commented on this before, but your above writeup compels me to do it now, whether liked/approved/accepted by most of our experts or not, but I for heavens sake have not digested the recent steel inserts into the Polymer frame of Baikal 2010 pretty well, still!!! :rolleyes:

IMHO, anything that's working completely fine and complaint-less, does not call for improvisation as such, that too within the same model, hence, I've never understood the logic or sudden change within the Viking frames!!! :rolleyes: We need to be objective here.

I am of the opinion that something must have compelled Baikal manufacturers to improve upon the design, and worst is that contrary to the CZ-999, which is the clone of a time-tested legend, we'll never have adequate reviews or reports on the durability tests of the Baikal Viking from the communist wings, and since it's not widely exported, if at all, to the western countries, nor any feedback on this from there. :(

I mean no critics as such, just some objective observations, and I hope you'll understand.

Finally, 12G bro, I'd appreciate if you could kindly elaborate on the last line of highlighted above. Thanks. Regards. :)

12GAUGE
07-11-2010, 01:17 AM
@AK47

"there is no doubt about it. from durability standpoint, it is better than any CZ 999 at any given day (with an unconfirmed but sadly most popular assumption that Baikal is built like a tank)."

with the above mentioned statement I am trying to say that I am only assuming that Baikal is more durable than CZ 999. however for this unconfirmed/unqualified/unauthenticated assumption is only based on popular opinion not fact.

Regards.

iffe
07-11-2010, 01:19 AM
@12Gauge

sir greeat comparison.
very knowledgeable

AK47
07-11-2010, 01:28 AM
@AK47

"there is no doubt about it. from durability standpoint, it is better than any CZ 999 at any given day (with an unconfirmed but sadly most popular assumption that Baikal is built like a tank)."

with the above mentioned statement I am trying to say that I am only assuming that Baikal is more durable than CZ 999. however for this unconfirmed/unqualified/unauthenticated assumption is only based on popular opinion not fact.

Regards.

"Popular opinion" ??? The "tank theory" seems to me more like a nailed down "cliche", somehow, we cannot judge anything from popular opinions, there has to be physical evidence for such, a torture test would be in order, who'll offer the gun, who the ammo? ;)

coolbox18
07-11-2010, 03:02 AM
@12 Guage sb
I truly respect your standpoint on guestimation, and variable milage others may have. That is the way discussions must be carried out, and opinions presented.
I would like to know what are the factors that make trigger of a baikal viking better than that of a cz999 scorpion?

superkoolguy
08-11-2010, 12:18 AM
What about norinco 9mm, isn't it good?

zeeshan.pk
09-11-2010, 10:03 PM
77b norinco is v good and reliable brother Super

zeeshan.pk
09-11-2010, 10:16 PM
pls restrict urself only to the extent of Cz s in this thread

s_stealth
04-09-2011, 05:35 PM
hello

on the topic 99 vs 999 - go for 999, it's updated design of 99
Serbian police (and good parts of army now) uses 99/999, one thing that gun is resistant to is mistreatment in maintenance as most of our police officers don't do regular maintenance...
regarding shooting, i tried all 3 of them (carried 99 as working gun) and best feeling and results I get with Viking

12GAUGE
04-09-2011, 05:48 PM
hello

on the topic 99 vs 999 - go for 999, it's updated design of 99
Serbian police (and good parts of army now) uses 99/999, one thing that gun is resistant to is mistreatment in maintenance as most of our police officers don't do regular maintenance...
regarding shooting, i tried all 3 of them (carried 99 as working gun) and best feeling and results I get with Viking

Welcome to the forum bro. may I ask which is more famous in your vicinity? the CZ 99 or CZ 999? and which one has most accessories available such as grips and adjustable sights?

Regards.

s_stealth
05-09-2011, 03:47 AM
thanks :-)
well 99 is more common because it is older and bit cheaper than 999 thus more accessories can be found for it (even some stuff ment for SIG can be used)... still, 999 is one hell of a gun...

Asiftt
10-09-2011, 11:46 AM
I have only some concerns on the fit and finish of CZ999, other wise its without any doubt feel so great in hands.

Enigmatic Desires
15-09-2011, 02:57 AM
Going back to the original topic. What precisely is the difference b/w cz99 & cz 999 scorpion?