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View Full Version : 9x19 in a 9x18(9mm in makarov)



SAJJAD ALI
28-11-2009, 02:10 AM
This video shows that we can use 9mm ammo in a makarov (9x18).is it safe or not????
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGRtEFH7VFg&feature=related

CougarMan
28-11-2009, 08:43 AM
NO. DO NOT DO THIS. THIS GUY IS A MORON AND DOING SOMETHING VERY DANGEROUS.

The 9x19 (lugar, parabellum) is a much higher pressure (35,000psi) round as compared to the 9x18 makarov (23,000psi). the PA63 and makarov PM are simple blowback pistols designed to work with the lower pressure round of the 9x18.

The reason that you can fit a 9x19 round in the weapon is that the diameter of the chamber in a 9x18 is 9.27mm. The 9x19 round is 9.03mm in diameter.

They are not interchangeable and not designed to work with one another.

Please do not post videos like this that may encourage less experienced members to try a very dangerous experiment.

Faisji
28-11-2009, 12:10 PM
+1 Cougarman

The guy in the video is a idiot IMO.

Skeeter60
28-11-2009, 12:56 PM
The rounds are not interchangeable COUGARMAN . Bravo; you very correctly brought out the technicalities involved.
The 9x19 or 9mm Para is .355 ins where as the 9mm Makarov is .363 ins. The pressures as pointed out are extremely high in case of the 9mm para.
The 9mm Para is recoil operated whereas the makarov is a simple blow back pistol because of less pressure.
This is a disaster in the making, unfortunately sometimes a lot of dumb/stupid people put up silly things on the net and especially on UTube. Please do not take these things seriously

Gilani
29-11-2009, 07:05 PM
Skeeter60 Sir, your indepth knowledge and solid advices are always enlightening for people like me. Thanks a lot.
One more thing Sir, though I realise it should be asked in the ammo section, but since the discussion is on...... can MP5 9mm ammo be fired in a pistol designed for 9mm parabellum ? I know the dimensions are same but the pressure I think is different.

regards

Skeeter60
29-11-2009, 07:08 PM
Skeeter60 Sir, your indepth knowledge and solid advices are always enlightening for people like me. Thanks a lot.
One more thing Sir, though I realise it should be asked in the ammo section, but since the discussion is on...... can MP5 9mm ammo be fired in a pistol designed for 9mm parabellum ? I know the dimensions are same but the pressure I think is different.

regards

Go ahead shoot it it is safe

Gilani
29-11-2009, 07:20 PM
Thanks a lot Sir :)

Skeeter60
29-11-2009, 08:05 PM
Thanks a lot Sir :)
Gilani Sahab
In the army the basic principle is commonality of ammunition; so that in the battle field the ammunition can be interchanged from one weapon to the other.
This misconception (MP5 vs Pistol ammo) was started as at one time about 35 to 40 years ago we used to have an SMC or the Sten Machine Carbine or commonly known as the sten gun in the Army. It was a blow back operated weapon which fired much lower powered 9mm rds and these had extra hard primers because of being blow back operated , the breach block used to be very heavy with a fixed firing pin and it fired from an open bolt, pulling the trigger sent the heavy bolt forward under spring pressure and rebounded after the firing and obturation was over.
When the MP 5 was introduced the old ammo would not cycle the MP 5 and there would be frequent misfires. Then the whole ammo lot was gotten rid off and the new MK 2 Z was introduced in the mid seventies. The new round is the proper 9mm round and can be used in the MP or pistols.
Thank you and Regards Gillani Sahab

MHMalik
29-11-2009, 11:17 PM
Use only ammo that is written on top of the firearm..

Its written there for a reason..

139
29-11-2009, 11:29 PM
It seems 9 x 19 has become standardized military issue ammo for handguns. Lately haven't seen any other caliber hand gun being introduced in any professional fighting force.

139

MHMalik
29-11-2009, 11:56 PM
But seems like the U.S is going back to 45s.. or at least trying to...

However the newer 9mms perform more or less at par with the 45s when it comes to energy transfer.. (I could be wrong here..

Enigmatic Desires
30-11-2009, 12:13 AM
Thanks for the info Sir.

I never knew it was possible to interchange the ammo even theoretically..

Haider Shah
30-11-2009, 01:33 AM
At darra few years back seen local gun smiths have chambered certain 9x18 Makarov into 9x19. I don't know what was the fate of itheir users .
Any one having fair idea about 9x17, short, Kurtz or .380 acp ammo availability, cost . How reliable it is once a comparison is with 9x19. Regards

Gilani
30-11-2009, 12:35 PM
Gilani Sahab
In the army the basic principle is commonality of ammunition; so that in the battle field the ammunition can be interchanged from one weapon to the other.
This misconception (MP5 vs Pistol ammo) was started as at one time about 35 to 40 years ago we used to have an SMC or the Sten Machine Carbine or commonly known as the sten gun in the Army. It was a blow back operated weapon which fired much lower powered 9mm rds and these had extra hard primers because of being blow back operated , the breach block used to be very heavy with a fixed firing pin and it fired from an open bolt, pulling the trigger sent the heavy bolt forward under spring pressure and rebounded after the firing and obturation was over.
When the MP 5 was introduced the old ammo would not cycle the MP 5 and there would be frequent misfires. Then the whole ammo lot was gotten rid off and the new MK 2 Z was introduced in the mid seventies. The new round is the proper 9mm round and can be used in the MP or pistols.
Thank you and Regards Gillani Sahab

Thanks again for such a detailed information, Sir. This clears the doubt. Actually I asked this question because some of my army friends had problems with firing POF made 9x19mm MP5 ammo with their pistols. Now when I recollect, I realise that problem has only been with Taurus 24/7 pro (extractor damaged). Otherwise, there have been no problems noticed with firing of POF made MP5 ammo with Beretta 92fs, Baikal M446, Llama, CF98, HF77B and even Akdal Ghost (these are the ones that I observed). May be 24/7 pro is very sensitive to high pressure ammo or those were the two faulty pieces that I came across ???????? :rolleyes:

Thanks and regards

MIdreesTaj
30-11-2009, 02:48 PM
But seems like the U.S is going back to 45s.. or at least trying to...

However the newer 9mms perform more or less at par with the 45s when it comes to energy transfer.. (I could be wrong here..

45 is a 45.. Dang you gotta look down the muzzle of 45 to know the difference .. LOL!

Well the new moden ammo like speer Gold dot and winchester SXT series does a good job in expansion showing consistent performance. Performance remains good even after the bullet has been passed through other barriers like heavy clothing and glass... but 45 in FMJ form is still equavalent to 9mm in modern loading...
45s in modern loading would easily expand upto .70 and even .80 inches..while 9s continue to expand .60 consistently with modern loadings...
but generally speaking 9s are no less lethal than 45 nowdays, provided both the rounds attain sufficient penetration inside target.