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MHMalik
28-09-2009, 07:45 AM
I would like to invite your kind comments on this rifle.

How accurate is it? What is the effective range etc etc.

In Short, a good review from someone with experience would be highly welcome.

Also, its local availability and rough price.

Thanks

AK47
28-09-2009, 07:54 AM
Buddy, I don't know about it's accuracy, I think with a rifle of this caliber, it's more the man behind it who counts, but I can tell you the round itself is one hell of a bang! I remember shooting it from a mountaintop at night, leave a side the first bang, the frightening sound of the bullet could be heard back as long as it kept travelling forward, and we shot at a very distant target! I wouldn't be surprised if the effective range came close to a Mile!

m1carbine
28-09-2009, 08:11 AM
I would like to invite your kind comments on this rifle.

How accurate is it? What is the effective range etc etc.

In Short, a good review from someone with experience would be highly welcome.

Also, its local availability and rough price.

Thanks

303 all time favourite rifle,saw action in wwii.Still in used by Pakistani Police.Very Accurate & good rifle.Though its obsolete now,but still you may find it with dealers who deals with old weapons or from a home deal.Average price is 15k.Irteza,one of our members got it & he may further put light on 303 rifle.

Bullseye
28-09-2009, 09:13 AM
It has one of the smoothest bolts ever made. In WWII german soldiers at the receiving end of MKI used to think they were under automatic fire. A legend in its own league.

Mig
28-09-2009, 02:06 PM
Yes.,. It have a 11 Shot Magazine.. You can bolt this rifle just like you are shooting a semi-auto. . but its PB. 303 ammo is used is Light Machine Guns and This Ammo is prohibited. Although, this gun itself is no more prohibited now. It never stops. Never the barrel get hot. Completely Wooden. Barrel is also covered with Wood.

2 types of Model come. one has got two horns and other got 4. Effective Range is very long. but it can hit a target upto 800m. Definately if one is used to with it, one can hit Targets more than that. never saw one with a Scope. Its a Tank. Never Break. Never Jam. Never hot. Never stop banging. Not recommended for Hunting. Its a military weapon. Heavy. Bulky. Bullet got a higher velocity then its contemporary Calibers.

m1carbine
28-09-2009, 03:02 PM
very detailed info Mig

Bullseye
28-09-2009, 03:13 PM
Yes.,. It have a 11 Shot Magazine.. You can bolt this rifle just like you are shooting a semi-auto. . but its PB. 303 ammo is used is Light Machine Guns and This Ammo is prohibited. Although, this gun itself is no more prohibited now. It never stops. Never the barrel get hot. Completely Wooden. Barrel is also covered with Wood.

2 types of Model come. one has got two horns and other got 4. Effective Range is very long. but it can hit a target upto 800m. Definately if one is used to with it, one can hit Targets more than that. never saw one with a Scope. Its a Tank. Never Break. Never Jam. Never hot. Never stop banging. Not recommended for Hunting. Its a military weapon. Heavy. Bulky. Bullet got a higher velocity then its contemporary Calibers.

I have also heard that its not recommended for hunting. Curiosity is killing me, Why?

CougarMan
28-09-2009, 07:56 PM
its not been used for hunting because it was/is a PB and getting ammo would be an issue. No other issues, it will handle all Pakistani game with no problem.

MIdreesTaj
28-09-2009, 08:07 PM
I agree... there is nothing wrong in using this cartridge as a game cartridge.. like .308 is used on deer somewhere in the world.. 7x57 on small and medium game.. then .303 british must be no junk.. similar military and sports background all over the world .. ballistics sound similar too...

Sialvi
28-09-2009, 08:36 PM
its ammo is standard ball hard point not suitable for hunting. soft nose r not available.thats why its not used for the purpose. there r more than two models of this rifle. MK1, 2, 3 ,4 and 5 thats called jungle carbine (short barrel). MK4 can be fitted with scope to use as a sniper rifle.

Mig
28-09-2009, 08:50 PM
@Bullseye. Every purpose got there own guns. Otherwise one can kill a deer with a Pistol also but hunters recommend you use a Rifle for it. So, during hunting we have to move a lot and we dont like heavy things with us. You can use it for hunting and it has been used very much for hunting too in older times but its not recommended due to its heavy weight and nothing else.

@ Sialvi. There are 6 types of ammo I myself saw of 303. I think soft nose was included in that. There were ballistic , Hammer Head, and if u look at the hard ammo which is generally used, its frame if much bigger then the diameter of the rest of the Cartridge. Its reason is that the Ballistic/hammer Head ammo of 303 take the full frame of the caliber and its also bigger in diameter. Hope that matches with the fact!:P

Sialvi
28-09-2009, 08:53 PM
i meant the common available ammo. army surplus. by the way have u seen 8mmx57 soft point ammo anywhere? ( sorry off the topic but need info)

Skeeter60
28-09-2009, 09:37 PM
Gentlemen the good old Rifle No 4 Mk 1 is a great rifle. The rifle cocks on closing the bolt and hence our infantry soldiers could reload while the rifle recoiled and fire immediately after recovering giving it a very high operating rate of fire ( not cyclic ).
It was extremely accurate and regular matches were fired at ranges of up to 600 yards,at Jehlum, and even a match used to be fired at 1000 yards , all with its aperture iron sight which had a very long sight radius.
It had a muzzle velocity of 2440 ft/sec with a 175 gr bullet and and 2050 with a 215 gr military bullet.
It was adopted in 1888 and retired from service in 1957. It was light,accurate and reliable.
It was known as Lee Enfield. The Lee came from the name of James Paris Lee a Scottish born American a fire arms designer and the Enfield came from the Royal Small Arms factory at Enfield Lock in England.
The sun never set on the British Empire thanks largely to this wonderful rifle. A book can be written on this rifle. A large number of dangerous game was killed because of this rifle and also a large number of british officers and sportsmen of that era were killed by dangerous game due to its inadequacy on large and dangerous game; no fault of the rifle. The hunter should have known better, but this was readily available.
It came in a number of models but the favourite will always be Rifle No 4 Mk 1. The Mk 5 came later but was niether as accurate nor well liked. ( I have both )
Truthfully speaking it had every thing wrong with it when compared with the Mauser but due to soft pressures and hefty leeway in the chamber and throat it worked flawlessly for 75 years for the british and and about 90 years or much more for others.
It was the first military rifle I shot in 1964 and later when I joined the army in 1967 I carried it God knows how many thousand miles in soaking rain and like all cadets do I was careful lest I was caught with a dirty Rifle and punished.
I hated it for carrying it miles and miles and yet I love it so much it is lying in my bedroom ready for inspection by the toughest Weapon Training Sergeant of any acedamy or infantry school. I salute Rifle No 4 Mk 1

Mig
28-09-2009, 09:42 PM
Very nice Skeeter60.

MIdreesTaj
28-09-2009, 09:47 PM
:) now that is a Soldier's piece of mind you get...
My rifle is nothing without me and I am nothing without my rifle ... nice Skeeter sb.
I too remember lots of stories of Tiger hunt in sunderban forests using the same 303bore or 3 not 3... and in the more of these stories if not most, 1-shot did not endup the big cat ... some real hard and dangerous spanning on days follow up was required...

Mig
28-09-2009, 10:01 PM
@midreestaj , I defined in above post that, everything has its purpose gun, we cant go for hunting Ibex with a Pistol... Although it can do the job as well. For that agressive big Cat. You must be having a Bigger Caliber. But 303 is also not a small kid, it can definately down the Cat with a single Shot lest you hit on the limbs.

Sialvi
28-09-2009, 10:51 PM
@Skeeter60
sir,very well defined indeed. offcourse No4 is most successful model among all 303s.

Malik1
29-09-2009, 12:30 AM
@Skeeter60! Sir we came almost generation after you so we missed it :) However my father fired a lot from it and praised it a lot. He was from 13 PMA L/C

Enigmatic Desires
29-09-2009, 03:39 AM
The Quaid-e-Azam was a great fan of the 303 at the Mausoleum complex I saw 4 .303's that belonged to him.. I simply love this weapon..

Its a gr8 pity its ammo is PB :(

m1carbine
29-09-2009, 09:41 AM
Persons like Skeeter60 Sb are great asset for Pakguns,full with knowledge,wisdom & experiance. May God bless him always.

Skeeter60
29-09-2009, 09:41 AM
The Quaid-e-Azam was a great fan of the 303 at the Mausoleum complex I saw 4 .303's that belonged to him.. I simply love this weapon..

Its a gr8 pity its ammo is PB :(

No ED No the ammo for a .303 is not PB. Relax and enjoy shooting this fine cartridge

AK47
29-09-2009, 09:45 AM
Persons like Skeeter60 Sb are great asset for Pakguns,full with knowledge,wisdom & experiance. May God bless him always. Indeed, it would be more than an honour to meet Sir Skeeter at the G.T.G. A true "Bazurg" in his chosen field!

Enigmatic Desires
29-09-2009, 02:28 PM
The Quaid-e-Azam was a great fan of the 303 at the Mausoleum complex I saw 4 .303's that belonged to him.. I simply love this weapon..

Its a gr8 pity its ammo is PB :(

No ED No the ammo for a .303 is not PB. Relax and enjoy shooting this fine cartridge


Oh. when I read the PB section of my MOI.. it did mention .303.. if they have changed it since then I am definitely going to get one before some1 somewhere has a change of heart an re-changes the rules again..

Mig
29-09-2009, 06:03 PM
Respectfully Saying to Skeeter60. But Pakistan Arms Ordinance Says, 303 Bore is Prohibited. Though, the Enfield Rifle itself is no more prohibited but, its ammo is still PB. I am not sure with latest amendments. Its PB because, the Light Machine Gun (LMG) uses .303 rounds, and All military usage rounds are prohibited. Further,information will be appreciated.

Naazer
29-09-2009, 07:09 PM
the lmg used by the PAK Army does not use the 303. It uses the 7.62 cartridge. The 303 is a surplus round.

Sialvi
29-09-2009, 09:41 PM
.303 round was used in Vickers, Lewis and Bren guns.

Enigmatic Desires
30-09-2009, 05:33 AM
Ah well.. I guess I'l just have to take a trip to the market an ask the shop keepers.

Last time I did that Tayyabaly in saddar karachi told me it was PB. But that was a year back when even 7mm BAs were considered PB in Karachi.

Mig
30-09-2009, 01:47 PM
.303 round was used in Vickers, Lewis and Bren guns.

Yes. and all three are machine guns.

@naezer. Might be the PAK Army doesnt use LMG with .303 caliber but the others do. Similarly, Pak Army does not use .223 in there guns but its PB cos of M16 and others.

Skeeter60
11-10-2009, 01:20 PM
Respectfully Saying to Skeeter60. But Pakistan Arms Ordinance Says, 303 Bore is Prohibited. Though, the Enfield Rifle itself is no more prohibited but, its ammo is still PB. I am not sure with latest amendments. Its PB because, the Light Machine Gun (LMG) uses .303 rounds, and All military usage rounds are prohibited. Further,information will be appreciated.

NPB or PB
Only full auto Rifles and SMGs ; not related to caliber;
I thought were PB and all others NPB, but lately I believe (not sure ) on newly issued licenses only .22 rim fire are being endorsed in Punjab unless one gives an application and the appropriate fee and then voila you can have your .450 magnum endorsed on the licence.
To the best of my knowledge and information no military /police force is using the .303 cartridge any more. Where as the .308 or the 7.62x 51 is used by all forces and is not PB unless the weapon is Full auto.

Naazer
11-10-2009, 07:51 PM
second skeeter60 completely on this one. Its the mechanism of the rifle that makes it PB or NPB. The civilian 308 in Bolt action is a NPB and so is the civilian .222 remington or the .223 remington. The military specs are 5.45x39 mm (and there is a sepaate debate on another thread on this as regards to its incorrect classification as a 222) and the 5.56 (and the 223 has reduced pressure!)

the 303 that my dad had he had the barrel leaded and gave as a present to a frined of his. I some times think how silly.

@skeeter60: abba is actually headed to lhr tonight-driving down i think. Hope he runs into you cos i think he is planning to meet up with Brig Saeed and Ayaz Amir in Isld.

@mig: sir the 303 is no longer in use by any military service in eiher service rifles or the MG equivalent. Its an obsolete military round. Even the NCC has phased it out in pakistan (not that i did my NCC) Some Police Stations in rural Punjab had the 303's a few yrs back and so did LHR Police-phased out i think. The Indian Police has 303's a fact that was painfully highlighted in the Mumbai attacks and even the assesment there was that it woefully old and obsolete. They still had 303's as left overs from the Indian Army and old rifles due to budget constraints. So your information is actually a bit incorrect. As far as the 223 is concerned its use is for the AR-15 version as the M-4 or 16 is chambered for the 5.56 mlty round. You ca fire a 223 round from it but firing a 5.56 in a AR-15 or a bolt actio will produce gases in excess of what the rifle is designed for!

Skeeter60
11-10-2009, 10:51 PM
@ Naazar
give me his no I am at Lhr
My email is < jawedu@hotmail.com>

ruffantuff
14-10-2009, 09:43 PM
.303 lovers, I to am looking for one however the availablity is almost non-existant. The current asking price for one rifle is btw 35k to 45k, which I found to be a bit steep, and the ammo is availabale, as WAH (as per a shop keeper) is still making this round.

My budget for a good .303 MK 4, is around 20 to 25K. Do let me know if one is available.

Enigmatic Desires
15-10-2009, 12:20 PM
35 to 45.. hmm which dealer in Karachi is offering at this price range?

Naazer
15-10-2009, 12:26 PM
wah doen make 303 ammo any more. The one that is available is the army surplus ammo

ruffantuff
15-10-2009, 02:31 PM
Enigmatic Desires

The price was quoted to me while I was travelling within Sind to Nawabshah, 2 weeks back, by Mr. Masood Ahmed (M/S Masood Arms),

Naazer

With respect to the ammo, this information was provided to me by Tipu at M/S Tayyab Ali - Lucky Star.

Naazer
15-10-2009, 02:58 PM
i like masood arms in nawabshah simply for the reason taht he got me crate of number 8's for a hunt a few yrs back when none were available.

well Tipu is misinformed on this one. wah has no reason to make 303 ammo.

khakiMB
22-10-2009, 09:53 AM
@Skeeter60,

Thank you for sharing the wonderful history of the .303. It definately has a lot of history and weight in its class.

Irttyza
29-10-2009, 08:20 PM
Sorry to revive this thread but i was away for sometime and wanted to share my experience with the SMLE MK5 aka Jungle carbine. it is the version with a shorter barrel than MK3 and MK4 and as a result is smaller in lenght than the other versions.

Accuracy wise it is good upto 300 meter.(at a static paper target) The sights are excellent,the bolt action smooth to operate even for a lefty (me) and the recoil keeps reminding your shouler for a week that you fired it.
Ammo is available. Mostly army surplus but it is sometimes "click-bang" or "Hang fire". Ammo cost is 35rps per pop. Darra ones are cheaper but i advise against them as I have experienced a squib round from the Darra lot and that kept my rifle out of action for some time.
I have shot one wildbore with it and it dropped dead.but the range was 40meters at the most.i think it is a good weapon with good design,ok sights and accurancy,and to me it is good enough for most of the game animals available here in Pakistan.

Zahid Hussain
29-10-2009, 11:20 PM
Well I dont know exactly about the effective range but I was able to shoot two bricks at a range of 200 meters and narrowly missed the third one.I think they are great but depends on the shooter himself the gun I used was a Lee Enfield no2 markIII.Some years back they were available in quetta at roughly 4000,5000 or sometimes at3000RS in local gunstores.The best one I think If you can find is an american made No4 mark1,mark1*or markII.
I would like to invite your kind comments on this rifle.

How accurate is it? What is the effective range etc etc.

In Short, a good review from someone with experience would be highly welcome.

Also, its local availability and rough price.

Thanks

KageFox
29-10-2009, 11:56 PM
...the bolt action smooth to operate even for a lefty (me)...


The SMLE was one of the fastest bolt-actions of its time. Some claim it to be twice as fast as the German Mauser action. It is rumored that in World War One, when the SMLE was first put to use by the British, the German thought that they were facing a machine-gun barrage.

Happy Shooting

Irttyza
30-10-2009, 12:01 AM
Yup well trained soldiers were able to fire 10 rounds effectively in less than a minute.what they termed as the "mad minute".

Enigmatic Desires
30-10-2009, 12:23 AM
During the ongoing operations. a number of Lees were seen captured by the army. Right there with the ak47s and the MP5s ...

So after more then a century the lee is still performing front line battle duty..

Starfish
30-10-2009, 09:46 AM
waisay, i have a question for you all. I never could understand why the bolt charging handle is on the right side, specially on bolt action riffles. i mean most firearms are designed for right handed shooters, so if i am a right handed shooter and i am firing the SMLE for example, wouldnt i be faster if i could use my left hand to operate the bolt without moving my right hand from the trigger?

Naazer
30-10-2009, 10:27 AM
if it was on the left then you wouldn be using your master hand to bolt the rifle would you? quicker to use your master hand buddy...

KageFox
30-10-2009, 10:33 AM
what would you use to support the rifle if the right hand is on the trigger and left hand is working the bolt... Riflemen don't always have access to bipods or other stable platforms to rest their rifle...

Starfish
30-10-2009, 10:48 AM
hmm true. I had the "trench" warfare type scenario in mind. Soldiers lying down and shooting.
thanks for clearing it up.

Enigmatic Desires
31-10-2009, 05:01 PM
A lee for as low as 3K
An ammo @45 each
:(

..

I can only imagine..

MHMalik
31-10-2009, 05:39 PM
hmm true. I had the "trench" warfare type scenario in mind. Soldiers lying down and shooting.
thanks for clearing it up.


Wow! quite an emotional topic I opened..

To answer Starfish, sir, the debate regarding which side the charging handle should be is quite a heated one. But during stressful times, the one on the right side is actually easier to manipulate than the one on the left.. (by this I mean the stronger side).

I would not name some rifles since they're PB, but if you ever get the chance to operate them with the charging handle on the weak side, it is apparent that weak side charging handles are a canine female. They take away concentration and it takes greater effort.

On stronger side weapons, yes, you do have to take your trigger hand off the grip to manipulate, but I find it to be an easier (read= more intuitive) task.

MHMalik
31-10-2009, 05:41 PM
@ Skeeter60 sir perhaps you could enlighten me on the jungle carbine?

How does it compare to the No.4 ?

And is it available in Pakistan? How much should one lay down for a good piece?

Thanks!

Shariq
31-10-2009, 06:13 PM
it is apparent that weak side charging handles are a canine female.
Sir i totally agree and really enjoyed your comment :)

Skeeter60
01-11-2009, 11:28 AM
@ Skeeter60 sir perhaps you could enlighten me on the jungle carbine?

How does it compare to the No.4 ?

And is it available in Pakistan? How much should one lay down for a good piece?

Thanks!
Malik Sahab I own both, the Mk 5 Jungle carbine was made specially for the Wingates "Chindits" The British Indian soldiers fighting in the tripple canopy jungles of Burma, who were trained to infiltrate behind the Japanese; who almost always beat them to it the rain forests were very hard to negotiate so a lighter and shorter version of the Mk 4 was made.
The shorter barrel makes a horrendous blast and flash so a flash hidder was added with little effect. The rifle is not as strong or as accurate as the No 4, as the lighter action is not so stiff, although the rifle is a delight to carry.
The Japanese Arisaka on the other hand ,with a proverbially strong action was heavy and sported a long bayonet
I think the No5s have another problem these have to be zeroed with difficulty and the rear sight is often drifted to one extreme or the other. I wonder this may be the problem with the few rifles I came across. The No 4s are phenominally accurate
and usually close to zero

MHMalik
01-11-2009, 03:02 PM
Sir if its not too much trouble I would like to see your Enfields when I come to Lahore next.. :)

Skeeter60
01-11-2009, 11:32 PM
Sir if its not too much trouble I would like to see your Enfields when I come to Lahore next.. :)
you are more than welcome. contact for fone (jawedu@hotmail.com)

Enigmatic Desires
03-11-2009, 11:37 AM
it is apparent that weak side charging handles are a canine female.
Sir i totally agree and really enjoyed your comment :)


Same here.... In fact I would love to "pirate' that one..

Mangloo Ramzani
31-01-2010, 06:04 PM
Salaams,

Sorry to revive an old thread, but I was wondering about the Enfields and came across this thread.

After going through all of the above I'm a bit confused about the following aspects:
1. Which enfield is better (out of #4 and #5 Mk1) for long range shooting or sniping?
2. Can u put a scope on the #4 or #5?
3. Can u get a licence or permit for one of these even if their ammo is prohibited?

Rotorcrafts
31-01-2010, 06:53 PM
Mangloo bhai, Good to see that you are participating actively in the forum, I say again that the .303 is not the best rifle for the purpose you want to use it for http://www.postimage.org/templates/images/smiley/evil/9.gif (http://www.postimage.org/)http://www.postimage.org/templates/images/smiley/laughing/6.gif (http://www.postimage.org/)

Malik1
31-01-2010, 08:31 PM
Salaams,

Sorry to revive an old thread, but I was wondering about the Enfields and came across this thread.

After going through all of the above I'm a bit confused about the following aspects:
1. Which enfield is better (out of #4 and #5 Mk1) for long range shooting or sniping?
2. Can u put a scope on the #4 or #5?
3. Can u get a licence or permit for one of these even if their ammo is prohibited?

I think most of the questions have been answered earlier in one form or the other. Let me re-capitulate them and add my experience as well:-

1. 4 is more accurate as compared to 5 called "Jungle Carbine" which has a shorter barrel and kicks like a mule. It is renowned to have a problem of wandering zero as well.
2. I have been told that a hunter (army officer) uses 5 with a scope. He lives at Lhr. I only heard, have never met him.
3. PB is to do something with the system of weapon and not the cartridge or bore. 9mm semi auto in NPB but fully auto is PB. All calibers above .22 are PB in auto function but NPB in bolt action.

Mangloo Ramzani
31-01-2010, 09:57 PM
Mangloo bhai, Good to see that you are participating actively in the forum, I say again that the .303 is not the best rifle for the purpose you want to use it for http://www.postimage.org/templates/images/smiley/evil/9.gif (http://www.postimage.org/)http://www.postimage.org/templates/images/smiley/laughing/6.gif (http://www.postimage.org/)

Rotor bhai, at the price I'll be paying for it ... I just need to know if it can be fun !!!! :D

win76
31-01-2010, 10:42 PM
My American made Enfields in .303 British

A Pattern 14 made by Eddystone and Savage #4 Mark I

The sights are British made...Parker Hale..

http://s4.postimage.org/emygr.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=aVemygr)

The pattern 14 at 200 yards...

http://s3.postimage.org/soLYi.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=PqsoLYi)


http://s2.postimage.org/14Ejur.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=Ts14Ejur)


http://s3.postimage.org/sswVS.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=PqsswVS)

http://s3.postimage.org/st4QS.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=Pqst4QS)

http://s2.postimage.org/14Eysi.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/image.php?v=Ts14Eysi)

The pattern 14 was made during WW1, the Savage No 4 Mark 1 was a lend lease rifle, made during WWII.

Rotorcrafts
31-01-2010, 10:53 PM
Welcome to the forum win76,
Amazing weapons you got there and the sights look Awesome.

win76
31-01-2010, 11:13 PM
Welcome to the forum win76,
Amazing weapons you got there and the sights look Awesome.

The sights were very hard to find, they are actually worth as much or more than I paid for the rifles.
I think the sights were made sometime in the 1950's or 60's...shooting sports in England seemed to be quite popular back then and the Enfield rifles were a popular platform for shooters.

The nice thing about the Parker Hale sites is that they fit onto the gun with no modifications.

Apalo
05-04-2010, 01:10 AM
my question about the .303.
i want to know the model of the above said gun which was used in !965 war by Pak army.AS one of my uncle is offering me the gun and he said that gun was used in the war, dont know the condition but should i go for it?

Denovo87
05-04-2010, 01:16 AM
my question about the .303.
i want to know the model of the above said gun which was used in !965 war by Pak army.AS one of my uncle is offering me the gun and he said that gun was used in the war, dont know the condition but should i go for it?

By all means; if you have a PB license :)

Dr Hanif Malik
05-04-2010, 07:54 AM
@win76,what a sight and rifle what is the size of target buleye:)??

Salahuddin Ayubi
05-04-2010, 08:26 AM
my question about the .303.
i want to know the model of the above said gun which was used in !965 war by Pak army.AS one of my uncle is offering me the gun and he said that gun was used in the war, dont know the condition but should i go for it?

By all means; if you have a PB license :)

+1

And if you have the means to get a PB license, it's a must have collectors' item.

Skeeter60
06-04-2010, 12:40 AM
Go with a Rifle No 4 mk 1 it is a tremendous rifle, it has a long sighting radius and its aperture or peep sight is as good as you can shoot

Mangloo Ramzani
06-04-2010, 01:48 AM
Go with a Rifle No 4 mk 1 it is a tremendous rifle, it has a long sighting radius and its aperture or peep sight is as good as you can shoot

The answer I was waiting for ..... :D

Apalo
07-04-2010, 01:23 AM
my question about the .303.
i want to know the model of the above said gun which was used in !965 war by Pak army.AS one of my uncle is offering me the gun and he said that gun was used in the war, dont know the condition but should i go for it?

By all means; if you have a PB license :)

+1

And if you have the means to get a PB license, it's a must have collectors' item.
but i some where read in this forum that its not a PB, because it is not an automatic rifle and bala bala, and that's why i was intrested and if it is a PB than its ammo will be a problem?

Apalo
07-04-2010, 10:01 PM
no reply...!

Denovo87
07-04-2010, 10:26 PM
apalo bro, all rifles semi,s, bolt action or bala bala.... except .22 are PB. In Sindh you can buy a bolt action rifle of NPB but not in Punjab. what license you have by the way?

Slayerjatt
07-04-2010, 10:41 PM
apalo bro, all rifles semi,s, bolt action or bala bala

balley bhai balley. :p

Apalo
07-04-2010, 10:54 PM
apalo bro, all rifles semi,s, bolt action or bala bala.... except .22 are PB. In Sindh you can buy a bolt action rifle of NPB but not in Punjab. what license you have by the way?

i just get a license and that is still open, i have to buy some thing with in a month.

Skeeter60
08-04-2010, 09:51 AM
All bolt action rifles are NPB please .Period

Tipu Sultan
09-04-2010, 01:17 AM
All bolt action rifles are NPB please .Period

What about Punjab and provinces other than Sindh?

Apalo
10-04-2010, 06:47 AM
and what if get a licence from sindh Govt, for all Pakistan..........................?

Shooter101
10-04-2010, 02:01 PM
lee Enfiled .303 is all times favourite rifle,its very accurate even it can be used as sniper rifle.it has rich history

303
20-04-2010, 10:08 AM
How could I remain silent when I prefer to choose 303 as my nick. I have fired it, owned it and modified it for use with telescope. Later I found out that original mounts for telescope were available on the internet. I selected my 303 with care. There are two versions as discussed by Skeeter60, which I owned. First the smaller rifle which is suitable for para drops. Next is the standard rifle with a long barrel, which came to me brand new. My shooting with the scope gave me a lot of pleasure. I mounted a Weaver 3-9X 40mm scope on it and had some classic shots, including a wait for two wild boars to get in line, and dropping both in one shot stone dead. The bullet went through the chest of the first, entered the chest of the second boar, and ricocheted against the backbone, going up with the pinn…gggg familiarly heard after ricochet. The heavy recoil tempted me to flinch. So I ultimately decided to go for a lighter rifle with low recoil, and moved over to 7 x 57.
I had accumulated a lot of ammunition for 303. Now the rifle, with base for telescope and modified cheek rest, and ammunition is available with an arms dealer in Lahore, at a very modest price.

Skeeter60
24-04-2010, 09:53 PM
A Lee Enfield .303 Rifle No 4 Mk 1 will kick you very hard once you put a scope on it as the butt angle ( Low comb ) is designed to be used with iron sights and the scope is mounted high. This forces the shooter to keep the head high rather than pressing the comb with the jaw.
The felt recoil is high other wise it really is not much of a kicker. The other thing is the metallic but plate .
If the butt plate is removed and a rubber pad added and also a leather pad to raise the comb is fixed it becomes adaptable and comfortable to shoot with a scope.
These rifles when converted for use as a snipping rifle had both these things done.
Some of these rifles after 2nd W War were converted in England and re-barreled as sniper rifles by none other than Holland & Holland. In 1988 I discovered one such rifle at Darra Adam Khel it had found its way through Afghanistan; I bought it but then a friend took it from me and it is his very prized possession

Apalo
24-04-2010, 11:13 PM
How could I remain silent when I prefer to choose 303 as my nick. I have fired it, owned it and modified it for use with telescope. Later I found out that original mounts for telescope were available on the internet. I selected my 303 with care. There are two versions as discussed by Skeeter60, which I owned. First the smaller rifle which is suitable for para drops. Next is the standard rifle with a long barrel, which came to me brand new. My shooting with the scope gave me a lot of pleasure. I mounted a Weaver 3-9X 40mm scope on it and had some classic shots, including a wait for two wild boars to get in line, and dropping both in one shot stone dead. The bullet went through the chest of the first, entered the chest of the second boar, and ricocheted against the backbone, going up with the pinn…gggg familiarly heard after ricochet. The heavy recoil tempted me to flinch. So I ultimately decided to go for a lighter rifle with low recoil, and moved over to 7 x 57.
I had accumulated a lot of ammunition for 303. Now the rifle, with base for telescope and modified cheek rest, and ammunition is available with an arms dealer in Lahore, at a very modest price.
can you please mention the name of the dealer and price of the ammo

HafizAhmed
25-04-2010, 12:47 AM
Where can you get a lee enfeild and whats the price ,?

303
26-04-2010, 03:31 PM
Please visit Haider Arms at Naqi Road, Anarkali Lahore to see the rifle fitted with telescope, on a mount, a raised cheek rest on the butt, and redesigned wood stock. Tel 042-7239029.

9mm Luger
26-04-2010, 09:01 PM
after reading Skeeter Sb comments and the whole 4 pages of this topic I am getting the itch to get one!! sadly havent got any free licenses but hopefully will get this gun one day..

@303 can you tell the asking price for the benfit of all... plz im just asking a price for reference not encouraging 303 for a sale! :P

303
27-04-2010, 02:02 PM
Hafiz and 9mm Luger, I gave you the contact for tHaider Arms, and I deliberately avoided quoting a price for it, as I do not own it any longer. However to give you a background, when I took it to Bukhsh Elahee for disposal, he offered me Rs 5,000 for it as a great favour. I had some dealings with Haider Arms, and a number of transactions of sale purchase and exchange. He offered me a package deal which hopefully gave me a better deal. Later he got a new butt fitted to it and modified the mount for telescope. I would not know his asking price now. As for the ammunition, though it is abundantly in use in the country, and also made in Khyber Pakhtoonkhwa, its price is not quoted on our website. If the dealer is fair, and current price escalation has not over run all statistics, you should get a original POF made rounds in iriginal packing for Rs 25 each.

9mm Luger
27-04-2010, 02:07 PM
thanks 303..

@ ALL my other question is what type of license will be needed?

I ask this because a lot of people are still telling me i cant get anything a .22 on new moi??

Salahuddin Ayubi
27-04-2010, 02:16 PM
9mm Luger,

Speaking of rifles, in Sindh (where you are), you can get:

- 'ANY' caliber in bolt action rifle category; and
- MAX .22 caliber in semi-auto rifle category.

...... It is my understanding, that for Sindh purposes, the above mentioned are NPB.

303
27-04-2010, 02:40 PM
303 is no longer in the list of PB. It is only in Punab that people are having difficulty in getting license for rilfe bigger than 22 as this clause is also included in Punjab Wildlife Act. Some dealer or agent may guide you about getting a new license.

Apalo
30-04-2010, 10:45 PM
if some one know a dealer in pujab for a bolt action license, please mention the dealer name address and phone number.

ARlover
01-05-2010, 12:50 AM
Well kept gun price info plz

Apalo
01-05-2010, 10:00 PM
can any body suggest the economical telescope for .303

Nazim Sahib
03-05-2010, 11:07 PM
why do the local people pronounce .303 as `three NOT three`????

MHMalik
04-05-2010, 01:40 PM
its actually Naught.. means zero.. slang I suppose..

Denovo87
04-05-2010, 01:42 PM
why do the local people pronounce .303 as `three NOT three`????

Not only locals but most the .303 lovers all arround the globe :)

AK47
04-05-2010, 01:48 PM
Actually it's 3 AUGHT 3, not NOT! Like in the early days of the AK-47 emergence, used to hear words like: "RAASHENKOP"! :lol:

More of "contagious" social habit, yet nevertheless, one way or another, we do understand 3 NOT 3! :)

Salahuddin Ayubi
04-05-2010, 03:40 PM
Well kept gin price info plpz

Its Denovo whom we all have to thank for this. He's quite 'in' into 'that' market.

Mangloo Ramzani
04-05-2010, 03:44 PM
its actually Naught.. means zero.. slang I suppose..

+1

Naught means zero or nothing, but it is not slang, its an actual word used for the purpose just defined! :D

Denovo87
04-05-2010, 04:53 PM
Well kept gin price info plpz

Its Denovo whom we all have to thank for this. He's quite 'in' into 'that' market.

Have (and can have more) GUN permits but for GIN permit.... very religious discrimination I must say :lol:

AK47
04-05-2010, 05:41 PM
Ha ha ha, so from NOT to AUGHT and now NAUGHT! Whatsoever buddies, it's a ZERO! :)

coolbox18
04-05-2010, 06:38 PM
Well kept gin price info plpz

Its Denovo whom we all have to thank for this. He's quite 'in' into 'that' market.

Have (and can have more) GUN permits but for GIN permit.... very religious discrimination I must say :lol:


oh, and i thought the 'bhoot' kinda gin

i almost contacted for spiritual guidance...

Sialvi
05-05-2010, 12:39 AM
MHMalik and Mangloo Ramzani r right. its naught means zero.

safeershah
29-09-2010, 03:40 PM
303

sir i need your email address plz :)

safeershah
29-09-2010, 04:01 PM
303
my email is safeershah@hotmail.com

BIG BORE
24-09-2012, 04:32 AM
Anyone, Need your update on POF Wah made or SMLE mk 4 No 1 availability and prices in Lahore. Thanks in advance.

Mawa
30-09-2012, 12:05 PM
Question from Senior members, Sir my father is a serving Brig in Pak army. he is been offered .303 as a complementary weapon which is offered to every officer. But to collect one, you need a open licence. I have a NPB open blue book Punjab, Question is can that gun be registered on such licence as earlier posts mentioned that its a prohibited bore. :S

Further more should i go for this?? is it worth utilizing my lic on it? I have also Martini Henry lee enfield 450cal 1895. ( Collection piece). I must futher point out, i shall have no issue with rounds, i can get as much as a want? what do you suggest?