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Zubair
24-09-2009, 04:48 PM
Have heard a lot that the magazines should not be kept at full otherwise the magazine springs get worn out. On the other hand at some international forums its being said that it doesn't matter now, only the frequent loading/unloading wears out the springs. Can anyone please elaborate on this.

Abu Al Hawl
24-09-2009, 05:03 PM
well the quality weapon have tough tension springs, magazine is meant to be loaded all the time, but how ever if not carrying your weapn as SD so no need to keep it loaded, or for HD keep on changing the mags once a month so it will give rest to other and will last long.

Denovo87
24-09-2009, 05:05 PM
As far as my experience is concerned, both of my Beretta magz are full for last 14 years without any indication of loosening etc.
I do reload & load them when ever I do pistol cleaning or they get empty when fired but fill them to full immidiately.
Would love to hear form other members.

Conceal Carry
26-09-2009, 01:11 AM
Good quality mag springs never get worned out just because of being compressed for prolonged periods. It's the repeated compression and release which wears out any spring including mag/recoil springs. So don't worry and keep your mag filled to the capacity. When they do wear out replace the spring.

MHMalik
26-09-2009, 04:48 AM
Keep em loaded. I just keep it full minus one round (just to give some margin).

Quality Springs in a good magazine are designed to stay within their compression parameters, both full and empty. They would lose their capacity if taken BEYOND their elastic limit. This does not happen inside a fixed magazine as there is no room for extra compression/decompression.

Just dont overload magazines beyond their capacity and you'll be fine.

In my limited experience, with good quality magazines, the springs will indicate when they become weak when your slide stops holding back after the last shot. That is the time to start looking for new springs/mags. They will not simply fail just like that. And this usually happens after years and years of extensive shooting full mags to empty.

A good practice is to keep marked practice mags different from everyday carry/home defence mags. Use the practice ones on the range.

HasanJamshad
26-09-2009, 09:47 AM
Nice information. My knowledge about the magazines is much different from the practicle experience of some of our esteemed members. I am a beleiver of the fear (myth or reality) that mag spring do wear out if kept under continous compression for longer periods. At the same time ammo kept under continous pressure may also get deshaped. Following is the base of my beleif.
No matter what make a gun may be all its parts have life span. Like barrel 25k, slide 40k, slide spring 30k etc. Why on earth a mag spring will have an unlimited compression life span?

Zubair
26-09-2009, 11:55 AM
Dont think a mag spring can have unlimited life like all living & non-living things. But if we buy a handgun for self defence with a 15 shot mag & are not able to utilize it fully then why not a basic revolver

Denovo87
26-09-2009, 12:14 PM
Nice information. My knowledge about the magazines is much different from the practicle experience of some of our esteemed members. I am a beleiver of the fear (myth or reality) that mag spring do wear out if kept under continous compression for longer periods. At the same time ammo kept under continous pressure may also get deshaped. Following is the base of my beleif.
No matter what make a gun may be all its parts have life span. Like barrel 25k, slide 40k, slide spring 30k etc. Why on earth a mag spring will have an unlimited compression life span?

Although all the main parts of a gun has limitted life span, some more some less but springs have the longest life span than all of them, IMHO.
Regarding the compression on spring, if you remove the spring from mag you will see its under compression all the time no matter its loaded with rounds are not, if you see a spring out of box it will almost be double the mag size.
Mag springs (of the reasonably manufactured pistols) are always made to be compressed 24/7.
So always keep your HD/SD mags full without being scared of these getting loose, you always can get a new spring or mag but not a lost life.

Sohail
26-09-2009, 12:21 PM
i never experienced any issue with that loaded mag, yes as said by denvo i also keep it on and off with cartridges whlie cleaning. i think it depends on the quality of the weapon.

regards

CougarMan
26-09-2009, 03:23 PM
you would do more to reduce the life of the spring if you keep loading and unloading the magazine.

for longer term use, download single stack magazines by one and double stacks by 2-3. That should be good for the spring life as well as HD.

Ahmad
26-09-2009, 04:22 PM
What i have read on many gun forums there hp a general agreement that quality mag springs do not wear under full compression

MHMalik
26-09-2009, 04:56 PM
Actually this theory started off with AK47 mags for reasons unknown to me. Maybe their mags do wear out or something. But then people started applying that theory to pretty much all firearms... and the urban legend was born.

KageFox
26-09-2009, 06:22 PM
I think its a good practice to keep rotating mags on a timely basis to release the tension in the springs... just so that the mags don't fail in times of stress...

Technically, a spring which is not loaded beyond its maximum compression point should have no problem extending back to its original, uncompressed, unextended length, but here, we are talking about months, perhaps even years, for those of us who keep a fully loaded gun for HD, but hardly fire it, and rarely, if ever, break down the gun to clean it (those are the only two times the mag spring gets to move)... so, anything's possible

Malik1
26-09-2009, 10:17 PM
My experience of magazines originates from my father's Browning .32 pistol. He would keep the magazine loaded for weeks, resultantly the springs lost the ability to retract back to the fullest in 3-4 years. Thereafter he went for local made springs and would load unload the magazine on daily basis. They lasted him life long. I also now follow the same drill of loading and unloading.

Conceal Carry
26-09-2009, 10:32 PM
My Mak mags are fully loaded for the last 11/12 years and they still perform flawlessly.



Nice information. My knowledge about the magazines is much different from the practicle experience of some of our esteemed members. I am a beleiver of the fear (myth or reality) that mag spring do wear out if kept under continous compression for longer periods. At the same time ammo kept under continous pressure may also get deshaped. Following is the base of my beleif.
No matter what make a gun may be all its parts have life span. Like barrel 25k, slide 40k, slide spring 30k etc. Why on earth a mag spring will have an unlimited compression life span?

Ka_Khan
26-09-2009, 11:45 PM
This topic was discussed some 6 months back also.Could not get that posts from data.
We all agreed that nothing happens to the quality springs.But still i love to keep my mags empty which are not in use :)

Malik1
27-09-2009, 12:12 PM
Thats being really smart :) Why to take a chance?

Glocky
27-09-2009, 05:48 PM
I've had magazines loaded for five years plus, all of them work perfectly alright. But i like to keep the spare ones empty as well.

Sharp Shooter
28-09-2009, 10:21 PM
Its a very controversial topic brothers...... i asked the same question from our esteemed members in the first islamabad GTG. but heard mixed views. i.e. both the theories

.... firstly nothing happens to loaded mags even after a couple of years.

.... secondly, they should be loaded/unloaded on periodic basis.

but above all.... i am still unsatisfied as wt if 1 has to carry them with him.

Conceal Carry
28-09-2009, 10:52 PM
1- It's not a controversial topic.
2- If you got mixed views, why are you still unsatisfied.
3- Trust the ones who say nothing will happen (me included) and fill one up to max cap and check out in ayears time.
4- Trust the the ones who say it will be damaged and keep the other one empty. If any thing bad happens to the loaded one (and its a good quality imported mag) after one full year I'll pay the replacement cost, provided you properly clean it and store in a dry place.



Its a very controversial topic brothers...... i asked the same question from our esteemed members in the first islamabad GTG. but heard mixed views. i.e. both the theories

.... firstly nothing happens to loaded mags even after a couple of years.

.... secondly, they should be loaded/unloaded on periodic basis.

but above all.... i am still unsatisfied as wt if 1 has to carry them with him.

Shariq
28-09-2009, 11:10 PM
I would like to share my experience.
My Father's HK-630 was bought in 1989. Since then its Mags were always filled to capacity and stored in a Wardrobe along with the Gun ( Except for very rare lube sessions ). I used those magazines and fired about 50 rds from it in April this year. No problems whatsoever was experienced.

Shahzeb
17-08-2010, 12:48 AM
yeah i completely agree with Denovo87, i keep my mags loaded fully, never had a problem :)

BERETTA
17-08-2010, 03:28 PM
i found one of my ruger mini 14 mags yesterday which i had lost 8 years ago which was fully loaded and they fired perfectly wihtout any problem so i think it depends on the quality of the gun

mhrehman
21-08-2010, 05:32 PM
Aoa All,

Well guys I have been thinking about starting this thread, it would be rather interesting to know your opinions regarding this question.

I have had this debate with many friends and got different opinions about it.

Well, the question is that should you keep your mags empty or loaded, I usually carry 6+1 mags with me for handguns, and almost all the handguns and the long guns I have their mags are also always loaded, some friends say that this is not good for the mag springs and if you store them in the loaded condition for a long time, the mag springs wont work properly. Others have completely different opinions and good reasoning behind them too.

I would appreciate to hear your comments on this question.

Vik
21-08-2010, 05:51 PM
Keep them loaded only for SD/HD weapon.

Rasal.Saleh
21-08-2010, 06:12 PM
Any weapon that your life can depend on should be loaaded to the max because whats the use of a 15 round gun when you are carrying only 10.
All other weapons when in the house i keep three to four rounds less than the Max mag capacity.

Regards

Afzaal
21-08-2010, 07:50 PM
i keep 3 rounds less than max capacity.

assad ahmad nawab
21-08-2010, 08:01 PM
dont keep max rounds, but atleast have some rounds in it, for your safty purpose

Anthrax
21-08-2010, 08:13 PM
I had the same question that was answered a few weeks back.

Lets look at it logically. A good company magazine with a 15 round limit is built specifically to cater 15 rounds. The mag spring will NOT get damaged by loading it to its maximum capacity. Mag springs are destroyed if you start customizing the mag to accept more rounds than mentioned.

So basically don't worry about maxing out your magazine capacity. Load em up without any worries!

mhrehman
21-08-2010, 08:46 PM
I believe I was not able to ask the question in the right way, what I want your opinion on is that while storing guns for a long time, say a year or so, should we keep the mags stacked up or keep em empty.

Denovo87
21-08-2010, 08:56 PM
I believe I was not able to ask the question in the right way, what I want your opinion on is that while storing guns for a long time, say a year or so, should we keep the mags stacked up or keep em empty.

mhrehman bro, if you are going to store guns for long period (that means you are not intended to use them during the storing period), whats use of storing ammo with it? I mean in the mags :) when ever you store a gun it should be stored,

1) after thorough cleaning & oiling.
2) wrapped in something airtight.
3) Magazines should be out of the mag well, stored seperately.
4) No ammo with the gun as there might be no effect to the magazine full with ammo but lubricant used with the gun n magazines can effect ammo itself .

Silent killerr
21-08-2010, 09:30 PM
I believe I was not able to ask the question in the right way, what I want your opinion on is that while storing guns for a long time, say a year or so, should we keep the mags stacked up or keep em empty.

mhrehman bro, if you are going to store guns for long period (that means you are not intended to use them during the storing period), whats use of storing ammo with it? I mean in the mags :) when ever you store a gun it should be stored,

1) after thorough cleaning & oiling.
2) wrapped in something airtight.
3) Magazines should be out of the mag well, stored seperately.
4) No ammo with the gun as there might be no effect to the magazine full with ammo but lubricant used with the gun n magazines can effect ammo itself .
+1

Lock & Load
21-08-2010, 10:39 PM
For long term storage I keep the mags/tubes unloaded and for SD I always keep the mags loaded. I do shuffle the rounds every now and then.

Dr Zakir
21-08-2010, 11:19 PM
there is no harm in keeping magazine to full capacity , it should function properly in any good gun . keeping it to full capacity for long duration may effect the magazine ultimately

Shariq
21-08-2010, 11:35 PM
My Father's HK-630 magazines were fully loaded for about 19 years ( 1990 to 2008 ). It was gifted to me in 2009 . Mags worked flawlessly when i tested fired the gun so i presume keeping mags fully loaded doesn't affect them much.

fahadkhalid
21-08-2010, 11:41 PM
i keep 12 rounds in both the mags at all times, i have never had any problem with my mags.

MianTaimur
21-08-2010, 11:50 PM
My Father's HK-630 magazines were fully loaded for about 19 years ( 1990 to 2008 ). It was gifted to me in 2009 . Mags worked flawlessly when i tested fired the gun so i presume keeping mags fully loaded doesn't affect them much.

I belive this sums up the entire debate !!

I am very lazy, when it comes to maintaining weapons......keep almost everything loaded and they work fine !!
However , I do keep a bullet or two less from the maximum capacity .

wasifali89
21-08-2010, 11:54 PM
there was no point of discussion here if it was for storage

yes ofcourse keep them unloaded

and if u have to use it

OFCOURCE keep them loaded

AK47
22-08-2010, 12:00 AM
My Father's HK-630 magazines were fully loaded for about 19 years ( 1990 to 2008 ). It was gifted to me in 2009 . Mags worked flawlessly when i tested fired the gun so i presume keeping mags fully loaded doesn't affect them much.

Now this is the best practical experience of maximum load, longest time, and still worked flawlessly!

Thanks Shariq Sir for the share, what was the condition of the ammo, visibly, after 19 years, any rust spots, etc, and had the gun been stored by special procedures?

@mhrehman..............Bro, I don't think filling ammo in mags, when purpose is storage, would be of any good, unless, what I believe you mean by "storage", is actually just something hidden away beneath your bed, for emergency use, and you like to have a few rounds in your toys......just in case! ;)

Actually, you just cannot "store" anything away, bro, and I know, it's very hard, can't think myself even of "storing" away any of my few items permanently/ for longer durations. ;)

American Lockpicker
22-08-2010, 01:04 AM
A few years ago I read in Guns&Ammo(popular magazine in the US about firearms) that an old building in Belgium was tore down and in the wall they found an MP-40 with 6 fully loaded magazines it had been stashed there during WWII by a member of the resistance. They took the gun out and tested all the mag springs and they worked fine. So go ahead and leave them loaded.

Shariq
22-08-2010, 01:13 AM
@AK Bro
Just lying in a closed wrapped in a gun bag. Round tips were blackened with discoloration of casing with some rust. Magazine also had minor rust on them but gun was as new.

AK47
22-08-2010, 01:19 AM
Thanks Shariq bro, what a treasure handed over to you, having been kept away for 19 years. :)

mhrehman
22-08-2010, 05:03 AM
@mhrehman..............Bro, I don't think filling ammo in mags, when purpose is storage, would be of any good, unless, what I believe you mean by "storage", is actually just something hidden away beneath your bed, for emergency use, and you like to have a few rounds in your toys......just in case! ;)

Ak bro I believe you have understood exactly what I was trying to say with hidden meaning, because there are certain rules to this forum I cannot openly discuss what I mean, but e.g for my carry long gun I have 9+1 mags, always loaded, thanks God I haven't got into a situation where I used em, but last time I loaded the mags was about 8 months ago.

Rasal.Saleh
22-08-2010, 05:39 AM
@mhrehman
Ak bro I believe you have understood exactly what I was trying to say with hidden meaning, because there are certain rules to this forum I cannot openly discuss what I mean, but e.g for my carry long gun I have 9+1 mags, always loaded, thanks God I haven't got into a situation where I used em, but last time I loaded the mags was about 8 months ago.

@Mhrehman brother if you ever need a friend to fight the war,
you can call on me.. :P :P :D :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: and maybe then we can use our USP tacticals with the added accesories (PB)

hope you dont take a little humor to the heart

Though i would suggest rotationg your magazines..

Regards`

bestmagician83
22-08-2010, 02:03 PM
i use my pistol apprx. after 2 week, in my home i usually use to keep my mags empty b/c at home i dont have to use the weapon but for the security perpose i have kept the ammo openly with the weapon so as far i can load 30 rounds in 2 mags in a min, for this i had practie alot.

but my opinion is that if you have the capacity of loading 15 round then, you may kept 7 to 8 rounds for a long storing time, but there is still no use to be loaded for the long time.

Shariq
22-08-2010, 02:47 PM
Thanks Shariq bro, what a treasure handed over to you, having been kept away for 19 years. :)
Yes it was. Sadly i had to sell it to satiate my voracious appetite for 9 mm ammo :)

Aquarius
23-08-2010, 12:23 AM
Personally I think if a handgun or let it be any other weapon like shotgun or rifle is stored for a longer period of time say for about six months to one year, then one should empty the weapon of ammunition, means it doesn't make any sense to store weapon along with ammunition for longer period.

Omer571
23-08-2010, 06:17 AM
Gr8 info Guys

Amjad Ali
23-08-2010, 01:24 PM
thanks for your kind informations guys

GUNFREAK
23-08-2010, 08:48 PM
I think that this myth was introdured by our dealer friends, and is probably ment for Pak made pistols. If fully loaded mags was harmful to the spring than all manuals of imported pistols would have stated in it.

regards

X_TATIK_GUNNER
23-08-2010, 09:22 PM
salaams to all
i agree with a lot of bro's here for keepin the mags full to capacity ... NO PROBLEMS .... i had three mags of .45 loaded and lost in the store since early 90's and found them last year almost after 15 yrs .... and on an occasion i emptied all three with out taking a single round out of the mag prior empting them through my pistol ... not a single hick up
MORAL .....
There's a diff in local and international metalurgy .

tyan
23-08-2010, 10:38 PM
If the magazine is quality made steel ones, you can store them almost forever.

If is aluminum magazine, I would load it 1 or 2 round less for long term storage.

If is polymer one, then there's the problem. The issue is on the polymer feed lip that holds all the spring pressure will be likely to deform after a while. Just a little bit that your eyes can't tell but it's enough to cause mis-feed. That's why Magpul, one of the top polymer mag maker, gives each of their mags a clip-on storage cap that the real function is not keeping the dirt out but to transfer significant portion of the pressure from the feed lip to the mag body. Lancer, another polymer mag maker, uses inlayed stainless steel feed lip on their polymer mag.

The mag body regardless of material and the spring will not be the problem.

Yevgeny Dragunov spent more time in design the magazine for for the SVD than the rifle itself. Most of the jamming in the M16 platform is not the rifle itself but its flimsy magazine that was originally designed to be disposable.

Aquarius
23-08-2010, 11:20 PM
@X_TATIK_GUNNER brother.. thanks for sharing your experience but that was just a coincidental case that you lost the magazines in your store & found it after 15 years & it still worked flawlessly.. ofcourse a quality weapon with quality magazines & springs will still be working fine even after that longer storage no doubt, but we are talking about the routine storage of firearm for longer duration means from 6 months to one year or more, in which case it doesn't make any sense to store the weapon with the ammunition loaded in the magazines.. also the unnecessary lubrication of ammunition in the magazines is harmfull..

On the other hand if we are going out for a weekend or on short vacation, then its logical to lock the weapon along with Ammo IMHO..... :)

PUNJTANI5
24-08-2010, 07:43 PM
for always loaded category keep 25shots for 30 shot mag
22shots for 25 shot mag
16-18 shots for 20 shot magazine
12shots in 15 shot capacity
10 shots in 12 shot capacity
8 shots in 10 shot capacity
5 shots in 6 - 8 shot capacity
this ways springs will not be fully compresses and so will notgive up when crucially needed

for a revolver a full chamber as there r no springs compressed

Shariq
24-08-2010, 08:02 PM
for always loaded category keep 25shots for 30 shot mag
22shots for 25 shot mag
16-18 shots for 20 shot magazine
12shots in 15 shot capacity
10 shots in 12 shot capacity
8 shots in 10 shot capacity
5 shots in 6 - 8 shot capacity
this ways springs will not be fully compresses and so will notgive up when crucially needed


Bro if you don't mind can you tell me how you come up with these figures. Plz quote source also.

AK47
24-08-2010, 08:31 PM
@Shariq bro....He believes in 2/3 spring compression. The problem with this formula is with 1911/Mak 8 shots types, what to do with 5-6 shots! Perhaps rely on a "ghulail" in the side pocket for the remaining job! :lol:

Anyhow, basically I believe replies being given here are for guns in use, not in storage, best would be to grease the mags a bit and keep them empty. :)

Gilani
25-08-2010, 12:06 AM
@X_TATIK_GUNNER brother.. thanks for sharing your experience but that was just a coincidental case that you lost the magazines in your store & found it after 15 years & it still worked flawlessly.. ofcourse a quality weapon with quality magazines & springs will still be working fine even after that longer storage no doubt, but we are talking about the routine storage of firearm for longer duration means from 6 months to one year or more, in which case it doesn't make any sense to store the weapon with the ammunition loaded in the magazines.. also the unnecessary lubrication of ammunition in the magazines is harmfull..

On the other hand if we are going out for a weekend or on short vacation, then its logical to lock the weapon along with Ammo IMHO..... :)
I agree. Despite the fact that many good quality mags can be kept loaded for longer durations, why should one keep them loaded if the weapon is to be stored for some time???

Aquarius
25-08-2010, 01:12 AM
I agree. Despite the fact that many good quality mags can be kept loaded for longer durations, why should one keep them loaded if the weapon is to be stored for some time???

+1 Gilani brother.. :)

12GAUGE
25-08-2010, 01:29 AM
AoA Everybody

I've been thinking over this subject and this idea (I coule be wrong) came to my mind. how about if we keep two mags loaded to 70% capacity and keep one empty and rotate mags once a month?

For Example: Three mags of 15 round capacity (A, B & C)

1. Mag A and B are loaded with 11 rounds each whereas C is kept empty.
2. After one month Mag B & C are loaded with 11 rounds each and A is kept empty
3. After one month Mag A & C are loaded with 11 rounds each and B is kept empty

This should provide some relief to the spring from any extended duration stress (atleast in theory). one can also reduce the time duration to 15 days, in case one want to be extra careful.

Just an idea. :)

Regards.

AK47
25-08-2010, 01:40 AM
@12 Gauge............Nice idea bro, sustainable, with mag spring durability, no doubts. :)

I just somehow feel, if available, buy at least 2-3 extra mags for your gun, now with 5 in hand, just keep one fully loaded and exhaust it till it can last, then change. I'm sure, 5 will outlive most of us and the gun! :)

Besides, since most of us do have multiple guns, alternate using them, while you keep the other one totally empty. :)

12GAUGE
25-08-2010, 04:15 AM
I just somehow feel, if available, buy at least 2-3 extra mags for your gun, now with 5 in hand, just keep one fully loaded and exhaust it till it can last, then change. I'm sure, 5 will will outlive most of us and the gun! :)

Bro, your idea sounds workable but it necessitates that we first have to establish the useful life of a fully topped off mag. I reckon, a fully topped off magazine would rapidly lose its spring tension causing failure to feed problems, specially in the event of critical (hostile) event. therefore your suggestion (in my humble opinion) only works if we exactly know for how long we can keep a magazine loaded to its max capacity without causing any ill effects.

economics also play a major part here. keeping three extra mags handy would be difficult and with available handgun options, the cost of three mags would roughly equate to quiet a bit of range practice which everybody suggests is very important.

given a safe estimate of 5000 rupees per mag, we are looking at additional commitment of 15,000 rupees. with that kinda money, one can buy around 375 rounds of ammo @ 40 rupees a pop and get himself/herself acquainted with their gun on a range. that acquaintance can potentially save life/lives.

Regards.

Gilani
25-08-2010, 04:45 AM
If one has more than one handgun, giving relief to the mag springs should not be an issue even without buying extra mags. :)

12GAUGE
25-08-2010, 05:05 AM
If one has more than one handgun, giving relief to the mag springs should not be an issue even without buying extra mags. :)

Ofcourse Sir, with more than one handgun giving relief to mag spring should not be an issue. however what would be your advice if a person only employs one (or owns only one) handgun for HD/SD purposes?

I know, it would be easier to advise that person to get another gun and rotate them shift/period wise. however in a bid to make things rather complex, lets assume that person has one gun and can only afford one for the time being. what would be your kind suggestion under such circumstances? lets say, he has just two mags for now and can possibly arrange one more.

Regards.

Fayaz
25-08-2010, 10:47 AM
I think that this myth was introdured by our dealer friends, and is probably ment for Pak made pistols. If fully loaded mags was harmful to the spring than all manuals of imported pistols would have stated in it.

regards

+1
agreed with you, if the full loaded magzine could be harmful in that case it must have been written on the manual

PUNJTANI5
29-08-2010, 12:15 PM
for always loaded category keep 25shots for 30 shot mag
22shots for 25 shot mag
16-18 shots for 20 shot magazine
12shots in 15 shot capacity
10 shots in 12 shot capacity
8 shots in 10 shot capacity
5 shots in 6 - 8 shot capacity
this ways springs will not be fully compresses and so will notgive up when crucially needed


Bro if you don't mind can you tell me how you come up with these figures. Plz quote source also.

weapons instructors of police and army tell this and urge this
i have done a lot of search on internet and found the similar sometime ago
plus in mp5 there is a mag cap of 30 and it is usually filled with 25 for protection of spring

plus the gun dealer and manufactuurer will never recommend it b/c then they will be unable to sell spare

u can google with the term "magazine spring care for prolonged use" and get the answers
i hope shariq bhaiyya u get the answer

StevenCline
30-08-2010, 08:11 AM
According to some opinions: Springs do not wear out from being compressed. They wear out from being constantly exercised. Like when you shoot them. So, if you want the mags to last the longest... never use them. :o :lol:

Being under constant compression isn't bad. Being left empty isn't bad. So, load them, or don't or switch them every month. I have 12 magazines for my 1911s. I shoot a match every weekend. I practice twice a week. I've not had a spring go bad in the last 2 years.

I carried three magazines for my duty weapon when I worked on the Sheriff's department, fully loaded, for three straight years. No problems.

I don't care about internet experts and the repeated hearsay of persons who don't actually know anything.


Much to much worry about nothing if you ask me. To quote Shakespear, "Much ado about nothing."

A.Abbas
30-08-2010, 10:05 AM
According to some opinions: Springs do not wear out from being compressed. They wear out from being constantly exercised. Like when you shoot them. So, if you want the mags to last the longest... never use them. :o :lol:

Being under constant compression isn't bad. Being left empty isn't bad. So, load them, or don't or switch them every month. I have 12 magazines for my 1911s. I shoot a match every weekend. I practice twice a week. I've not had a spring go bad in the last 2 years.

I carried three magazines for my duty weapon when I worked on the Sheriff's department, fully loaded, for three straight years. No problems.

I don't care about internet experts and the repeated hearsay of persons who don't actually know anything.


Much to much worry about nothing if you ask me. To quote Shakespear, "Much ado about nothing."

I got 8 mags of handguns (mostly 9mm). 2 of them 15rd capacity, were kept loaded for last 6 months with full capacity 15rds, emptied today out of curiosity, nothing happened so for.

Just one piece of advice, make sure spring is not rusted or rusting, if there is one, clean it and oil it.

In my experience, even if you get 100 extra mags, only 2 or max 4 will be in active use, you won't touch the rest of them to keep them NIB if you resell (common human nature).

A.Abbas
30-08-2010, 10:11 AM
As for as the shotgun mags (tube or box or drum) are concerned, I'll not advise to keep them loaded even for a week (not for the springs but for the rounds), with rounds of non metal casings. These will be deshaped and you'll experience lot of FTFs.

PUNJTANI5
30-08-2010, 10:14 AM
mr. steven cline is totally right
but i had experience of spring failure on a pre WW-II made russian tokarev TT 33
it has no markings on it only 38 written on reciever in front of trigger guard depicting year of manufacture to be 1938
its spring was unable to go full load and i had to get the spring changed and the gunsmith asked me to keep the mag with 5 or 6 rounds instead of full seven
since then i am keeping 5 rounds in the magazine

plus i have many replacement magazines (20) all have been filled with only 5 shots each and placed securely in a bag in my closet
breaking off of each magazine was atleast 50 rounds fired before commissioning

plus if u compress a spring fully for a long period of time , it will lose its tensile strength

u can also google "revolver vs pistol" for the same opinion
this can only be done in a gun which has a limited capacity magazine that is actually 15 shot but has been reduced somehow using a nagazine break or insert to 10 round capacity etc

in my humble opinion

A.Abbas
30-08-2010, 11:36 AM
According to some opinions: Springs do not wear out from being compressed. They wear out from being constantly exercised. Like when you shoot them. So, if you want the mags to last the longest... never use them. :o :lol:


Any good quality spring will not loose its tensile power for years while kept compressed or uncompressed, every spring regardless of good or bad have the tendency to break (from first few cycles to many years). Only unevenly tempered (heat treated) sprigs will loose its tensile power or you may call its effective length within few cycles.

Now let me try to explain the wear out phenomena, almost all of us have experienced by themselves or have seen some one some time, breaking metal pieces (when tools were not readily available for the job or too lazy to get them), by constantly twisting the metal piece/wire in opposite directions (if you experienced to touch it, you feel it warm/ hot) finally breaking it. If you didn't experienced this thing, just take a piece of wire or metal sheet, start twisting/bending it opposite direction until it break.

What happens when you twist the metal in opposite direction constantly
By twisting/bending in opposite direction, we are actually generating heat by stretching and compressing the metal simultaneously at one point on opposite sides, heat makes metal harder and hardness makes metal brittle.

Here is a practical experiment every one of you can do to know the effects of uneven/irregular heat treatment (temper), take two springs (any metal spring, any size), make these red hot on the fire, put one in the water while it is red hot, let the other cool in room temperature, press or stretch both these springs one by one, you 'll see, the spring cooled in room temperature fully compressed or stretched like it is no more than a metal wire, the instantly cooled one will break apart like glass instead of metal. This experiment will well explain the effect of uneven/irregular heat treatment.

A well made, well treated spring will not lose its tensile power/length until it breaks apart by continuous usage or eaten out by rust, helical and spiral spring can take more beating than leaf spring.

And in the end of this lengthy typing after a long time, if you don't want your imported (walati) mag spring to be damaged simply don't use it and a desi handgun mag spring costs around RS. 80 to100/= (depending single or double stack).

A.Abbas
30-08-2010, 11:47 AM
Here is link to almost an year old thread regarding the same question.

A.Abbas
30-08-2010, 11:48 AM
Sorry forgot to paste the address. :D
http://www.pakguns.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2516

fahadkhalid
30-08-2010, 11:59 AM
+1 to A. Abbas for a detailed review on springs. One exprience I would like to add here, my dad locked up hi CZ 83, with a mag loaded to full capacity in it and the spare loaded fully also, while we were shifting back in 1993. The gun and the spare mag were wrapped in a shopping bag and taped allowing no air to to go inside. Last year while cleaning up the store, he opened that suitcase, brought out the gun, no rust whtsoever. took it outside and let a rip. All the rounds fired flawlessly. Yes i do agree if the point is storing a gun for a long period, then there is absolutely no need to leave it loaded, but in a good weapon, it wont harm the springs. Btw just out of curiosity, wouldnt leaving the spring uncompressed for a very long time, make it hard as well?

A.Abbas
30-08-2010, 12:06 PM
Here is the best quot from the last year thread by Denovo87, complete text enclosed with the comprehensive question and the best answer.



Nice information. My knowledge about the magazines is much different from the practicle experience of some of our esteemed members. I am a beleiver of the fear (myth or reality) that mag spring do wear out if kept under continous compression for longer periods. At the same time ammo kept under continous pressure may also get deshaped. Following is the base of my beleif.
No matter what make a gun may be all its parts have life span. Like barrel 25k, slide 40k, slide spring 30k etc. Why on earth a mag spring will have an unlimited compression life span?

Although all the main parts of a gun has limitted life span, some more some less but springs have the longest life span than all of them, IMHO.
Regarding the compression on spring, if you remove the spring from mag you will see its under compression all the time no matter its loaded with rounds are not, if you see a spring out of box it will almost be double the mag size.
Mag springs (of the reasonably manufactured pistols) are always made to be compressed 24/7.
So always keep your HD/SD mags full without being scared of these getting loose, you always can get a new spring or mag but not a lost life.

A.Abbas
30-08-2010, 12:13 PM
And this issue was discussed 6 months earlier from the last years thread, quotation form the last years thread. ;)


This topic was discussed some 6 months back also.Could not get that posts from data.
We all agreed that nothing happens to the quality springs.But still i love to keep my mags empty which are not in use :)

And this will be discussed again in 6 months time. :lol: :lol: :lol:

AK47
30-08-2010, 12:17 PM
@A. Abbas.......+1! :)

I believe we think of a spring as a "straight" thing, which is compressed "straight" in length, according to the number of rounds filled. It's not so! :|

The spring apparently is already "bent in intervals", hence tension "subdivided" in segments, and it's already much longer in extended length than the mag itself, when extracted. Thus the "compression" is already there with or without filled ammo, and the spring is hence designed in such a way, that taking the "tension/compression" is just it's workload. :)

I'm now convinced, especially in the light of the spring design, as well as from the experience of members of +15 years of loaded, yet excellently working mags, that "compression" as such is what the spring is meant for, and will have no detrimental effect as such. :)

However, to get back to the actual question, it's needless to keep mags loaded in weapons meant for storage. :)

A.Abbas
30-08-2010, 12:18 PM
Fahad brother only excessive heat i.e fire or moisture (which lead to oxidation) can heart a quality spring.

fahadkhalid
30-08-2010, 12:21 PM
Thanx A.Abbas sb. A+ on your report card for this one ;)

A.Abbas
30-08-2010, 12:23 PM
@A. Abbas..........
However, to get back to the actual question, it's needless to keep mags loaded in weapons meant for storage :)

100 % agree, storage mean storage, very simple common sense. :) makes no sense to keep mags loaded unless storage is kind a storage which mean, keep ready, not sure if the weapon will be used or not and for how long. (this is the kind of impression I got from the thread starting post of mhrehman)

Fayaz
30-08-2010, 10:42 PM
And this issue was discussed 6 months earlier from the last years thread, quotation form the last years thread. ;)


This topic was discussed some 6 months back also.Could not get that posts from data.
We all agreed that nothing happens to the quality springs.But still i love to keep my mags empty which are not in use :)

And this will be discussed again in 6 months time. :lol: :lol: :lol:

as long as newbies are are joining, same old topics will be discussed again and again.. here almost each and every topic i found new for me from which i definately gain some knowledge..

gun_craze
30-08-2010, 11:47 PM
As for As my humble view/comment is concern i am fully agreed with AK47, A.Abbas and other members who are in favor of loaded mags...

I don't have much experiences to share but do have one in this connection...I have CZ70 and without any exertion I don't remember that I ever left the mag empty since 1998... but it was working gr8 to date (just checked on Saturday ;) )...

@ Fayyaz Bro u are absolutely right as I am also a newbie :D

mhrehman
01-09-2010, 05:12 AM
@A. Abbas..........
However, to get back to the actual question, it's needless to keep mags loaded in weapons meant for storage :)

100 % agree, storage mean storage, very simple common sense. :) makes no sense to keep mags loaded unless storage is kind a storage which mean, keep ready, not sure if the weapon will be used or not and for how long. (this is the kind of impression I got from the thread starting post of mhrehman)

Sirs that was exactly the reason, and I do thank you all for the great info

PUNJTANI5
10-09-2010, 02:29 PM
i think we should summarize

1. donot store guns with magazines loaded fully or partial hence for the a child may have access to it
2. for always loaded mags keep a few rounds less 4 spring protection
3. always keep guns and ammo separately stored

Rizshu
31-10-2010, 08:12 PM
More stress is probably placed on a magazine spring by shooting only one full magazine at the range than in keeping the magazine completely loaded for ten or twenty years.
The shock absorbers on a car or truck are not likely to suffer much damage if the vehicle is kept stationary ~ regardless of the load to which the shocks are subjected. Putting the car on a lift when it's parked won't do much to prolong the life of the shock absorbers.
If, however, the vehicle is taken for drives on very bumpy roads, the shocks become stressed and may in time suffer enough damage to warrant their replacement.
Magazine springs, similarly, are insignificantly stressed by keeping the magazine loaded. They are much more stressed when the pistol is fired. Unloading the magazine, rotating magazines, etc., is akin to parking a vehicle on a lift to spare the shock absorbers.
Magazine springs are one length when they are first wound. They take on a set and their extended length becomes shorter when they are compressed manually to their solid height. This second extended height is the same whether the spring is very briefly compressed to solid height or held completely compressed for a year.
Shooting a single magazine through the pistol will shorten the magazine spring beyond the above mentioned second extended height, whereas keeping the spring compressed for a year will not. Shooting hot or heavy recoil producing ammo puts more stress on a magazine spring than shooting lighter loads. It is the bumpier road.

Seems reasonable to me.