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KageFox
20-09-2009, 02:27 PM
I was just wondering, are there any good, reasonable options in this category? Meaning lightweight and concealable.

I came up with the Glock 26, which is too expensive, or the three Taurus compacts (Millennium Pro PT 111, PT609 & 24/7 Compact), all of which have reliability issues.

Any suggestions, ideas or options on similar pistols? The objective is comfortable conceal-carry, so hopefully, the discussion can be limited to lighter, polymer-framed guns.

Adeel Ahmad
20-09-2009, 02:34 PM
Well kage a friend of mine owns the PT609 and so far he had no issues with it except once which i also shared with everyone on this Forum. You should look into it and buy the Titanium version as that is a bit lighter as compared to steel one.

KageFox
20-09-2009, 02:38 PM
Already have experience with the PT609, gave problems with POF. However, in its support, it works okay with Serbian hollowpoints and Chinese rounds,

As of right now, I'm not looking to buy anything... just looking at different options...

Abu Al Hawl
20-09-2009, 02:38 PM
i wish those Taurus compacts could have been that reliable that i dint had to spend 315k for a g26

Adeel Ahmad
20-09-2009, 02:52 PM
Well if PT609 is a no go then i think there is nothing else except G26.
You should talk to Moeen Bhai and he might help you in importing Smith&Wesson M&P 9C. That one would not cost you as much and would still do the trick.
If you get one, let me know and i will also buy one with you.

Abu Al Hawl
20-09-2009, 03:01 PM
Adeel, what do you think it will cost less, how much would it cost ? i my opinion it will cost not less than 250k

Glocky
20-09-2009, 03:03 PM
If import is an option then there are better options than the M&P compact like Kahr, Keltec or Walther PPS for concealed carry

Abu Al Hawl
20-09-2009, 03:09 PM
i wish i could get this cz 2075 rami, which is with hammer and as same size of g26

http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/4392/75277152.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/)

Glocky
20-09-2009, 03:13 PM
That does look nice :)

Adeel Ahmad
20-09-2009, 03:26 PM
Glocky i know that there are a lot of other options and i gave that suggestion because reasons i cannot disclose on Forum.
Abu, he can call Moeen and get proper info as i think it wont cost that much.

ay_be_why
20-09-2009, 07:22 PM
i wish i could get this cz 2075 rami, which is with hammer and as same size of g26

http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/4392/75277152.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/)

do guns really come in that size?? :o
:)

Monis
20-09-2009, 09:48 PM
Nice for conceal carry

AK47
21-09-2009, 01:43 AM
i wish i could get this cz 2075 rami, which is with hammer and as same size of g26

http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/4392/75277152.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/) Can't understand why our importers can't find this kind of stuff for us? Moeen Bhai, come forth plz about import possibility of this gun.

KageFox
21-09-2009, 12:29 PM
The RAMI is a nice option. If someone has availability/ import options or ideas, please come forth.

Silent killerr
21-09-2009, 01:49 PM
why dont you do for Taurus PT 809

KageFox
21-09-2009, 02:00 PM
Too large, its a full frame pistol. If they made a compact version (near the size of Beretta PX4 Storm sub-compact) then it could be considered.

Dr Zakir
21-09-2009, 03:54 PM
Walther pps would be good option provided it is available at a good price . I had bought a millenium but it's aim was way off . Glock 26 is quite expensive .
What u guys think about the range of subcompact pistol

Dr Zakir
21-09-2009, 03:55 PM
Cz is looking nice any body has an idea about availibilty and price

Abu Hafs
21-09-2009, 04:40 PM
"More powerful than a 9mm"


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyRVCIkFsDc

MHMalik
21-09-2009, 05:35 PM
I would prefer the PPS too. I think it is one of the better subcompacts out there.

It would also be worth mentioning that the handguns being mentioned here are subcompacts which are in fact smaller than the compact sized ones (consider the Glock 19, USP Compact, the smaller Taurus offerings).

A friend once brought a Taurus titanium to the range. It looked really nice and the finish was also superb. Unfortunately it was giving a lot of problems with the older POF ammo that we had. We switched to a newer 2008 stock and it worked fine. It is a bit finnicky with ammo. If that were not the case I would have bought one for myself.

I am guessing what taurus needs is some gunsmithing to its internals. After all people polish feedramps and stuff and make their 1911s flawlessly reliable, so why not these. I'm sure the problem with it is due to some small irregularity or something. Irregular tolerances perhaps? With the brand being so popular here, a person who does manage to make them reliable will make a killing!

KageFox
21-09-2009, 05:50 PM
The PPS is one of the slimmest 9mm pistols around. However, price would be a major point when considering this gun.

As for the range of a sub-compact, it is unreasonable to expect it to produce target accuracy, and match-sized groups. Most pistol combat occurs within a small range, experts sometimes citing 7 yards as an average. I believe that at such ranges, you do not bother (or get time) to aim and simply aim and fire...

The Taurus PT-111 when compared the Glock 26 & RAMI, in terms of size, gets beaten in the height department. This is a major factor to consider while planning for concealed carry.

Dr Zakir
21-09-2009, 08:06 PM
quite right , i believe when u are using for SD / HD u should use best quality ammo what ever the gun make and size would be if PT 111 is performing well with good quality rounds then would be a good option

KageFox
21-09-2009, 09:31 PM
I have yet to see a misfire occurring when PT-609 is used with Serbian (Prvi Partizan) HPs. No FTEs, No FTFs.

Dr Zakir
22-09-2009, 12:05 AM
any idea about current prices of mellinium series ?

Agent47
22-09-2009, 03:01 AM
hmm.the taurus 7 slim line series is worth mentioning here.

Dr Zakir
22-09-2009, 11:00 AM
i think i will try to find cz rami

KageFox
22-09-2009, 11:07 AM
The Taurus 700 Series is pretty slim and compact, but I don't think it has been released in the market, let alone the Pakistani market. The version of 709 currently on the Taurus website is very different from the earliest versions.

Abu Al Hawl
22-09-2009, 11:10 AM
Dr. Sahab if you could find Rami for me AP KI AIN NAWAZISH GO GI SIR JEE

KageFox
22-09-2009, 11:27 AM
Best option would be to approach someone who imports CZ guns... (not CZ999 - that is a product from a different company)

Abu Al Hawl
22-09-2009, 11:45 AM
KF, this the product of the same company yar CZ.

KageFox
22-09-2009, 12:37 PM
Ceska Zbrojovka of Czechoslovakia (CZ-USA being its American counterpart) makes the CZ-75, 83, 85, 97, 100, P-01, 2075 RAMI etc. They are also the ones who make Brno rifles.

Zastava Arms of Serbia manufactures the CZ-99 and CZ-999

These two companies have no direct connection, and the only common thing is them using "CZ" as the initial of their handguns.

Hope that helps.

Slayerjatt
22-09-2009, 01:51 PM
is cz rami polymer or alloy framed? and if it wasn't for polymer, i would love to cc a walther ppk in .32 caliber.

KageFox
22-09-2009, 02:08 PM
The CZ RAMI comes in metal and polymer-framed versions.

RAMI P
http://www.postimage.org/gx1R6xCS.png (http://www.postimage.org/)

RAMI
http://www.postimage.org/gx1R6Wzi.jpg (http://www.postimage.org/)

Glocky
22-09-2009, 05:50 PM
The Taurus 700 Series is pretty slim and compact, but I don't think it has been released in the market, let alone the Pakistani market. The version of 709 currently on the Taurus website is very different from the earliest versions.

It was launched in the shot show 2009, it is available in the USA. Can't stand the brand :( POS in my opinion

KageFox
22-09-2009, 06:55 PM
It was shown at the SHOT Show, but its not available on the couple of online gun sellers I checked (Impactguns, Ableammo). And the 709 showcased at SHOT and the one displayed on the Taurus website are two different guns. Rumor has it that the original underwent several key changes over the past year.

The brand itself simply has a bad reputation, and is pretty good actually, once you get to know it, but hey, everyone's entitled to their own thoughts and ideas...

Glocky
22-09-2009, 07:02 PM
It was shown at the SHOT Show, but its not available on the couple of online gun sellers I checked (Impactguns, Ableammo). And the 709 showcased at SHOT and the one displayed on the Taurus website are two different guns. Rumor has it that the original underwent several key changes over the past year.

The brand itself simply has a bad reputation, and is pretty good actually, once you get to know it, but hey, everyone's entitled to their own thoughts and ideas...

Its not a rumor, they did make several changes to the design mostly cosmetic, and it is freely available in the US,

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/55284


I have experimented with enuff Taurus products and wasted money to try again. :)

regards

Glocky
22-09-2009, 07:17 PM
A brief pictorial review of the new design

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=366541